Author Topic: Quiz Time!  (Read 975675 times)

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Offline Hugo

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Re: Quiz Time!
« Reply #3840 on: October 09, 2024, 09:53:08 am »
Dave. would you please reveal the location?

I've got some comments to post about the stones but I don't want to post them until the answer is revealed.

Offline DaveR

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Re: Quiz Time!
« Reply #3841 on: October 10, 2024, 03:32:03 pm »
Dave. would you please reveal the location?

I've got some comments to post about the stones but I don't want to post them until the answer is revealed.
It's at the side of the pavement on the prom, across the road from the Marine Hotel.


Offline Cambrian

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Re: Quiz Time!
« Reply #3842 on: October 10, 2024, 04:50:31 pm »
There was about 30 years ago another stone set at right angles to the one opposite the Marine.  Sadly this was obliterated when Aberconwy BC carried out some works.  Luckily, the one shown survived.  The old parish boundary actually runs along the line of the prom so any land seawards of the grass verge is in Llandudno parish as far as the Little Orme.  This is a bit of a puzzle.

There's also one in the grounds of Holy Trinity as the boundary runs through the site and until the changes in the 1930s, the chancel of Trinity was actually in the neighbouring parish of Llanrhos and thus in a separate diocese altogether!

The other one depicted is in Albert Street and the next one is in the verge of St David's Place.  Another is in Bodafon Street.  All the rest seem to have been lost either through development or simply become overgrown thus forgotten. 

Llandudno Museum have a similar stone with the letters "CL" marking the boundary between the Conway Liberty and Llanrhos.

Offline Hugo

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Re: Quiz Time!
« Reply #3843 on: October 10, 2024, 06:51:06 pm »
Well done Dave, you're spot on with the answer           A question is only easy if you know the answer

Thanks too Cambrian for posting all that info on the Parish Boundary stones as a lot of local people are not aware of them

For anyone that is interested in local history, the Deganwy History Group have got a fantastic website that is really good and worth reading.   More information and photos of these stones can be found on their website under the heading " The deserving poor of Eglwysrhos"

https://www.deganwyhistory.co.uk/research_articles/parish-boundary-stones/

I'll post some more on these boundary stones tomorrow as I'm off to the pub soon


Offline Hugo

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Re: Quiz Time!
« Reply #3844 on: October 11, 2024, 12:34:16 pm »
Just as an add on to my posting last night,  I always thought that the Parish Boundary stone opposite the Marine Hotel because of its location and the position it was placed in marked the end of the Parish of Llandudno but I couldn't have been more wrong.
Cambrian knew the exact boundary and I was amazed when I found out from him.      The Llandudno Parish for some inexplicable reason carried on as a narrow strip of land( roughly where the Promenade is today ) and turned in to Craig Y Don just past the Queen's Road ( see photo )
It then went up to Nant Y Gamar and then turned east to encompass the whole of the Little Orme and on its way passed just south of the old Windmill
I had a look at the Parish map and it was exactly as Cambrian had described so it was really interesting to know the facts

I wonder why the boundary went in such a direction and thought that perhaps it was affected by the Enclosure Acts of the 1840's and that it was a cunning plan of Mostyn Estates to get their hands on the lucrative quarries of Nant Y Gamar and the Little Orme
I could be wrong about that idea too because in Chris Draper's book "Llandudno before the hotels"  at pg 95 is a drawing of the boundary circa 1200 and it is the same as in my photo.   But at least thanks to Cambrian I now know where the true boundary lies

Offline mull

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Re: Quiz Time!
« Reply #3845 on: October 11, 2024, 06:00:10 pm »
Hi Hugo, Map is small so unable to see ---did Penrhynside come inside Llandudo boundry ?

Offline Hugo

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Re: Quiz Time!
« Reply #3846 on: October 11, 2024, 11:20:47 pm »
Have a look at this link Mull,  you can enlarge it and see where the boundary went.       From the old windmill it seemed to by pass all the houses in Penrhynside and came out by what is now the childrens play area at the top of Penrhyn Hill
If you can remember those old toilets at the start of Bryn Y Bia Road they would appear to have been in the Llandudno Parish but the rest of Penrhynside would have been in Eglwys Rhos




https://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/CAE/Llandudno

Offline mull

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Re: Quiz Time!
« Reply #3847 on: October 12, 2024, 11:05:09 am »
Thanks Hugo, always thought it was in Eglwys Rhos.

Offline Hugo

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Re: Quiz Time!
« Reply #3848 on: October 13, 2024, 09:53:10 am »
I seem to have hijacked the Quiz with the Llandudno Parish stones and last night I had a detailed look at the Parish boundary depicted in the map I posted.    Although it has a resemblance to the boundary map of the 19th century it is inaccurate.    The positioning of the stones as posted by Cambrian prove that the map is misleading.
Cambrian is an expert on the Llandudno Parish boundary and last night I was reading a post he made under Geology and research and I found it so interesting that I have copied the article again.    It is further proof that the map I posted was inaccurate.
Cambrian's previous post is shown below and it is very interesting

"Hugo, I take your point re boundary.  For some reason - possibly Mostyn influence - there is an odd narrow strip of Llandudno Parish which extends along the seafront to link with an almost detached portion of that parish around Bodafon/Nantygamar and Little Orme.

Not sure if you recall in the 1970s, there were two of the boundary stones set together at right-angles at the edge of the grass bed opposite the Marine Hotel.  Some bright spark in Aberconwy BC destroyed one for no good reason but fortunately the other was saved and as far as I know is still there.  The right angle of the stones indicated the route of the boundary of the parishes along the sea front.  Town side was Eglwysrhos but the seaward site was Llandudno! This all goes to explain why Mostyn have their involvement with Bodafon fields etc and were lessors of the Little Orme Quarry. What is now Craig y Don was part of the Peers Williams holding which was from Clarence Road to Nant y Gamar Road.  General Peers Williams lived in a house called "Craig y Don" near Beaumaris hence the origin of the name in Llandudno.  Sorry I have wondered from the topic a bit! "

If I can find the 19th century map again I'll post it on here

Offline Cambrian

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Re: Quiz Time!
« Reply #3849 on: October 13, 2024, 06:43:25 pm »
Hugo

Thanks for your kind comment!  I thought I had posted something on the boundaries some time ago.

There is an excellent site maintained by National Library of Wales which has the Tithe Maps easily navigable plus overlays of current and old OS maps.  It's quite fascinating and you can easily spend hours surfing the details including field names, land ownership and lessees.

You can find it by Googling Tithe Maps of Wales.  It is split into (Ecclesiastical) parishes so boundaries are fairly clear.

I did ponder the strip along the front linking the town with Penrhynside and Little Orme.  Initially I thought it was a Mostyn inlfuence but am not now sure of this.  Chris Draper's 1200 plan obviously pre-dates any Mostyn activity in the area and the two Mostyn seats, Bodysgallen and Gloddaeth, were both in the Parish of Llanrhos or Eglwysrhos rather than Llandudno.  I wonder if the strange boundary has more to do with the Manor of Gogarth rather than Mostyn per se.  I will have to do some more research on this.

Incidentally, the C19th 25"/mile OS maps show most of the boundary stones clearly. 

Offline Hugo

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Re: Quiz Time!
« Reply #3850 on: October 16, 2024, 08:28:55 pm »
I just wanted to say thank you for posting that info about The Tithe Maps of Wales    I found it truly addictive and it brought back memories of the railway line in Cwm Road and my old playground in the Gas works
I could also see Castell Tremlyd and the river that was in Maelgwyn Road along with a lot of other interesting things.    Anyone interested in the history of old Llandudno should enjoy it.   Thanks again for that posting

Offline Hugo

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Re: Quiz Time!
« Reply #3851 on: October 24, 2024, 03:14:05 pm »
It's only easy if you know the answer but where exactly would you see this sign?

I'm looking for the name of the street or road it is located in and not for any street, road etc that it may be near.   

Offline Hammy

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Re: Quiz Time!
« Reply #3852 on: October 24, 2024, 05:27:04 pm »
Hugo,
Is it on Ty'n-Y-Maes Hill, Llandudno?

Offline Hugo

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Re: Quiz Time!
« Reply #3853 on: October 24, 2024, 06:33:30 pm »
Well done Hammy that's the correct name for the street.            I was expecting answers like Cwlach Road or Street but you were spot on

Mull posted about the hill and the sign and I went there today to have a look.  Parking the car in Llandudno today was difficult as it was so busy but I did manage to park in Church Walks and like everyone else's car mine was half on the road and half on the pavement
Let's hope that the Wales Government doesn't ban partial pavement parking or else Llandudno's parking problem will get worse