Points to Ponder

[Ian]

I gave my opinion as i see it, maybe not exactly politically correct (to the word), but hopefully not offensive to anyone apart from paranoid people.

So only ‘paranoid’ people are offended? Or those with ‘an ageist chip on their shoulder’?Generalisations about a single group of people based on nothing more than your own views can offend a lot of people. Simply because someone is prepared to speak to you over them doesn’t make them paranoid. And at the outset I only asked you to define what you meant by ‘old folk’. The reason I picked up on what you posted was simply because it’s the over-60s that largely keep Llandudno in business during the out of school-holiday season. It was when there was no reply that I selected the three statements I’d read that I thought could cause offence. And you may be right: it was perhaps confrontational to describe them as “offensive, ageist bile - or simply blissful ignorance” but I did want to establish that we don’t want comments posted that might offend.

I joined this forum, not to argue, but to be social

Fine.  But if what you post is likely to cause offence or in a topic about improving Llandudno is based on inaccurate information then surely it needs correcting?

NOT to be picked up on EVERY point

Well, apart from assuming all the people over 65 are old and ‘OK with the rain’, and the fact that it invariably rains what other points have you ever been picked up on? Sorry, but when people say things about Llandudno and its visitors which are simply wrong I believe they need discussing.

I don’t see why I have to justify everything I post. Everyone has views!!!!

I agree entirely. But some views are hurtful and can cause offence.

Outsiders views seem not to be welcomed on this forum.

Actually, new members’ views are always welcome;  after all, everyone on here was new at some time.

Ian is too confrontational to run this forum.

There are forums everywhere where people are savaged, abused, ridiculed and bullied but Dave and I set out to make this one a place where that wouldn’t be allowed to happen.  We have have only had to deal seriously with a couple of people, and we spent a lot of time considering whether we ought to. On balance, we felt that if they’d stayed the forum might have suffered damage. 

I don’t believe you intended what you posted to hurt anyone but - like a lot of things in print - once it’s there it can be taken the wrong way. You’ve made 127 contributions over more than two years since you started posting. You’ve helped people with PC issues and your knowledge of avian wildlife is truly impressive.  Until this week you’ve never posted anything even mildly contentious and you’ve made a great contribution. So I’m sorry if you feel I was being too confrontational but I was concerned about the way your comments could be perceived.  This is an open forum which anyone in the world can browse without having to register. It appears close to the top when any query about ‘Llandudno’ is typed into Google and if the first thing a recently-retired couple looking for somewhere to spend a few days see is a post saying it invariably rains or that everyone over 65 is considered to be ‘old folk’ who are fine with the rain then I believe it could give a very damaging impression of the sort of welcome they could expect.

[Ian]

Oh dear Ian,  you appear to have done it again! You really do need to have a little think about how you come across, and the impact you have on those thinking about dipping their toe in to this (supposedly) open Forum.

Oh dear, Fester? Remember Ludo?

“Ludo, your pics are fantastic - keep them up.”

(1_rob_1 almost two years ago).

Ludo was one of the most creative and capable contributors we ever had. Now, why did he leave, I wonder?

But it would be so much better if I thought that my opinions had some merit too. 

But you post so many it’s hard to keep track…  WWW WWW WWW

Seriously, anyone’s opinion is as valid as anyone else’s.  It’s only those which are making assertions based on faulty facts or which are potentially hurtful that I take issue with.

[Fester]

Thanks for keeping it mercifully short.. I read it all!

Seriously though, regarding Ludo,   he broke strict Forum rules by posting pictures of where I work, and other derogatory comments.... (I seem to recall similar upset for 'another member' which culminated in some nonsense involving the word 'REST') 
But at NO TIME did I ask Ludo  to leave the Forum,   in fact I implored him to return.... which he did, for one post I think, and then disappeared of his own volition.

Can the same be said of another vibrant and interesting poster..... one 'BrumBob?'


By the way, you have asked a few questions of 1-Rob1 this morning,  but has he not clearly stated that he will never post again?    You might be in for a wait longer than for a new attraction on the Pier Pavilion site!   

[Yorkie]

Are you sitting comfortably?  Then I shall begin.

Once upon a time there was a link on the Forum where one could see a list of the Membership.  Could view their profile and see details of their postings.  Unfortunately the Membership List is now unavailable to Members as is the facility for mailing direct to each other on matters that are of no general interest to the Forum as a whole.

However, I am just an ordinary user of the facility as we all are!

 ZXZ

[born2run]

As you can all see, I have butted out of this discussion. I gave my opinion as i see it, maybe not exactly politically correct (to the word), but hopefully not offensive to anyone apart from paranoid people.
 I will do as I have done in the past, & watch the forum but not sign in. I will not make any future postings as I joined this forum, not to argue, but to be social/ get on/ diacuss local matters, & try to help its members with any tech probs that are posted. - NOT to be picked up on EVERY point made/or not.
I dont see why I have to justify everything I post. Everyone has views!!!!
I can now see why Yorkie was P****d off & was about to leave the forum last year-ish.
Outsiders views seem not to be welcomed on this forum.
Any members I have helped in the past are welcome to email me if they have any pc probs, issues & I will gladly help.
Ian is too confrontational to run this forum. (look at the statistics - they are declining).
Out of here.
Rob

That's a shame, I thought you were very engaging and good for the forum, when I asked you what you meant by undesirables in this topic for example you explained succinctly and made some other good points which advanced the discussion, you didn't get wound up or annoyed or question my motives for asking you or look to start any argument. Hope you reconsider and stay onboard. BTR

[DaveR]

Once upon a time there was a link on the Forum where one could see a list of the Membership.  Could view their profile and see details of their postings.  Unfortunately the Membership List is now unavailable to Members as is the facility for mailing direct to each other on matters that are of no general interest to the Forum as a whole.

Why do you need a list of the Membership? As far as I'm aware, you can click on any Members' name next to their post and view their Profile etc.

As you're well aware*, Members can contact each other by clicking the little envelope symbol under the Profile Photo. if an Envelope symbol is not present, it's an indicator that the Member does not wish to be contacted privately.

* - http://threetownsforum.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,2336.msg61674.html#msg61674

[Ian]

Seriously though, regarding Ludo,   he broke strict Forum rules by posting pictures of where I work, and other derogatory comments.... (I seem to recall similar upset for 'another member')

Yes, but you've openly told everyone on the forum where you work and even invited them down to see you. Would you like me to post the relevant link again?  D)

[Yorkie]

As it happens DaveR, I do not need to know who all the Members are, but do find it strange that they are all hidden from sight unless they post to the Forum!  But then if they were in the public domain someone may come along and purloin them for another Forum.  That would be a shame, as another Forum would then have the majority of its Members as non-posters.   Are these non-posters cleared out occasionally or just left to just be part of the numbers game?

 

[DaveR]

Why do non-posters need to be cleared out? Some people like to just read the posts and it's a lot easier to just see all the new posts if you are logged in as a member.

[Yorkie]

Why do non-posters need to be cleared out? Some people like to just read the posts and it's a lot easier to just see all the new posts if you are logged in as a member.

It is what is generally referred to as Good Housekeeping, no relation to the magazine!  It is up to each web master or Forum admin to deal with their  baby as they want to.  You have chosen your way and if we don't like it we can buzz off elsewhere.  I certainly don't post on the Forum as much as I did because I think it has got a bit stale and needs new and fresh input.   Just my opinion.
 ZXZ

[Ian]

I think all forums go through a period where posting is reduced.  MIT did some work on this, and suggested that there's a two-fold process at work, which also occurs in society generally. Initially, everyone's new and a lot of posting takes place as folk are naturally inquisitive. Forums also grow a lot during this period.  The second phase is where well-established groups of posters, who are all familiar with each other, post intermittently and often post amusing asides. This phase has also been called the 'clique' period, since newcomers become wary about posting where there are clearly a lot of well established posters so although the forum continues to grow in membership, far fewer actually post.

[Yorkie]

Ian said, "far fewer actually post."

So going back too housekeeping, what is the point of keeping memberships alive when people have not posted for, say, a year?  Most Forum Software has a facility for just this sort of pruning.  However, as it ain't my problem why should I even bother to mention it?
 Z**

[Ian]

Mainly because some folk reappear after long absences and then get upset if their membership is cancelled in the meantime. I'm involved in several forums, and none of them ever deletes the inactive posters. And, as Dave has pointed out, many log in and view the forum without posting. For instance, in the last two days alone, 60 members have logged in but only a handful have actually posted.

We have 1900 registered members and we actually have 54 that applied for membership but have never logged in. We don't know why that is, but that's another reason we keep all the members, since we always match IP addresses when someone asks to join. If their IP address is already registered we tell them. 

[Fester]

For instance, in the last two days alone, 60 members have logged in but only a handful have actually posted.

So why do we think that might be?
What might prevent someone from raising their 'voice'?
Could it be natural shyness?  Could it be fear of ridicule?
 

In the past 12 hours, quite a number of Forum members (past and present,  posters and non-posters) have texted and emailed me regarding the recent discussion on this thread.
I do appreciate the comments and kind words enormously guys, but if you were to put some of those words on here, then perhaps we could move this issue forward..... rather than little old me (inebriated as I am,  once again this evening) ... having to battle on alone against insurmountable (and vastly more intelligent) odds. 

You know who you are....     

On a more serious note,, (burp) .... I don't want to see any members disappear.
I want more members, more posters... and more contentious discussion, (to spice things up)

For example, ''someone'' said to me today... ''why is the phrase 'old folk' offensive?,  old folk being a category must mean that using the word 'children' is equally offensive''
It's common sense like that which humbles us all.... (hic)..... I'm going to bed.

[Yorkie]

We have 1900 registered members and we actually have 54 that applied for membership but have never logged in.

Quite frankly Ian you are expounding one large mouthful of garbage in your posting!   What on Earth is the sense in maintaining a list of almost 2000 Members when there is only about 20 pf us who regularly contribute to the debates?  Except that nowadays, there are fewer and fewer debates or entertaining discussions.

Most of the space over recent months are just photographs of flowers, food, and bedrooms.  The only really worth while amongst them being Hugo's Walks which are both interesting and entertaining.  Long may they be seen on the Forum!  What i cannot bear myself, is the exchanges between some Members which, because of the personal nature of the exchnges, would be better carried our by a messaging service rather than a public Forum.

I have pointed lots of people I know to the Forum and have written the adress down on countless scraps of paper and serviettes to try and encourage them to join us.  Why haven't they joined and contributed, because on first sight they found it uninteresting.  I have now given up on this exercise and shall leave the Admins to carry on in their own way.

I too belong to other Forums so do not miss my pleasures of having intelligent conversations with like minded people.
 Y^^Y