Evan Jones b 1776 Llangystenin

[gilesc]

My family member Evan Jones is described as a farmer in the 1841 census living at Tan Rhyn Llangwstenin.
I'm wondering whether he would be a tenant of the Lloyd family/ or Mostyns etc or were there farmers who actually owned their own land and that time? I don't live locally and therefore can't get to the archives ( the staff there are v v helpful though and I don't want to push my luck) Can any forum members answer my query, better still does any one have a copy of any land ownership records?
I look forward to hearing from you
Regards
Carolyn.

[Cambrian]

The best guide is probably the Inclosure Award made in 1848. A copy of this should be at the County Borough Archives in Lloyd Street.

From what I can tell, a Mr Evan Jones was both a leaseholder and a freeholder in the parish of Llangwstennin.  The Commissioner who made the Award allotted various parcels of land to Evan Jones based on his freehold land ownership, but also granted other lands based on Evan Jones' leasehold lands "called Tynrhyn Farm".  So it looks as though he leased the farm  - from I would think the Mostyns.  Evan Jones seems to have owned Penybont and a cottage.  Hope this gives you a start.

Another source would be the Tithe Records for Llangwstennin parish but these could well be at the National Library of Wales in Aberystwyth which is where the Church in Wales has deposited most of its old records.

[gilesc]

o Cambrian,
Many many thanks for this. You have been really helpful.
Diolch
Carolyn

[Hugo]

I had a coffee morning today and sat next to a person who was born and bred in Bryn Pydew which is a village nearby.
He knew the place well and also knew the last family to farm this place. They were called Owens and when the parents died they did not continue farming but sold the farm, land and out buildings in separate lots.  This would indicate that they owned the property but whether it was freehold or not I couldn't ascertain.
I came down through Bryn Pydew this afternoon and took these photos of the farm. It looks like the place has been converted into two properties with a shared driveway.  The first property in the drive is called Tyn Rhyn and the second property is the one photographed from a public footpath higher up the road leading to Bryn Pydew.

[Cambrian]

Hugo is correct that part of the range of old outbuildings has been converted into a new dwelling - this was done in the last 5 years.
If you look at Hugo's lower picture, in the bottom left you can also see an overgrown ruin with a chimney stack.  That is the original farmhouse.  A replacement farmhouse was built to replace this one and can be seen in the upper right hand side.
A public right of way runs through the farm track so all this is quite visible if you are in the area.

[Hugo]

The public footpath doesn't look like it is used very often Cambrian and I was told that the Owens didn't like it going through their property anyway.
I walked along the shared drive just to see which house was which and met a couple of ladies walking their dogs along the driveway. The names of the two properties seem the same just that they have abbreviated them differently which seems strange.

[jane B]

I was interested in this as it covers the area my relatives the Roberts' lived. The Tyn Yr Yrn is the address given on the marriage cert for Elias Roberts 1840. he was a labourer there. Thanks for posting the picture, I hadn't asked about this before so now I know where it is.

[Hugo]

That's a nice coincidence Jane.  The farm has lovely views but because of the terrain I would think that farming there in those days would have been quite hard.
You'll find the location after driving down the lane from Llangystenin Church to Glanwydden and taking the steep first left turn to Bryn Pydew, the buildings are down the track on the first bend.
 If you were to go a further 200 yards up the the Bryn Pydew Road then you would see Ty Ganol on your left.  Isn't that where another of the family once lived?

[jane B]

Yes Hugo, one of the Roberts' lived there. The Jones family must have known the Roberts, I wonder if any marriages took place? I don't know much about the women in the family.
Life must have been so hard for the workers, so many children long hours and low money. We don't know we are born despite the credit crunch!

[gilesc]

Dear all,
Once again thank you for all the info and especially the photos. I do know that Even Jones married an Elizabeth Roberts in 14th Nov  1801 in Lllangystennin. I have no info on her parentage yet, so if any of you can take me back to the next generation (backwards) of Elizabeth's family that will be great.
BTW Pls may I use the photos and send to my family?
Regards
Carolyn.

[jane B]

Checked out my family tree as far as I know but no sign of an Elizabeth that far back. I only have a few relatives names in the early 1800's. The details on a marriage certificate might be enlightening. It was lovely to read something more of the history of the area anyway.

[Hugo]

When I was in the Conwy Archives this week there were not many Rate books for Llangystenin and the one I picked didn't have anything in it for Tyn Rhyn so I couldn't confirm the ownership of the farm.
When I've wanted similar information in the past I've applied to the Land Registry Wales and they have given me the info that I wanted. There is a small fee for the service.
I'm sorry that the photos were not of a better quality but of course you can use them and I'm glad if they can help in any way.

[Hugo]

Just as a matter of interest the name Tyn Rhyn I think is a misspelling of the farm's name.    I believe that it should have been "Ty yn yr Ynn"  or "Ty'n yr Ynn" to shorten it a bit, but the name has been abbreviated over the years.
The name "Ty yn yr Ynn" in English means House in the Ash Trees, which is a fitting name because of it's woodland setting.

[Hugo]

Just had a second thought about the name and if Tyn doesn't have an apostrophe between the y and the n then it could have a slightly different meaning:-
Tyn (tyddyn)  yr  Ynn and that would translate as "a small farm or cottage of the Ash Trees".     

[Hugo]

Just stopped to take a photo this morning  of Tyn Rhyn and Tyn Yr Ynn looking across from the cold wet fields of Llandrillo