great orme cemetery

[suepp]

have you tried putting Enoch into the IGI  familysearch website, it throws up some interesting results!
http://www.familysearch.org/eng/default.asp

[emma p]

Had a quick look suepp, thanks. Ive got Richard and Elias up and Enoch married to Elinor but nothing for other children yet. It was only a quick look though so ill have another good look later.
 

[Hugo]

If Enoch didn't have a son called John then this other John must have come from a more notorious side of the Roberts'     

[emma p]

Can find nothing for Enoch......says no results when i put in dates etc !!! ??  Where am i going wrong ? 

[Hugo]

Emma, I'll put you out of your misery and tell you about the John Roberts I was thinking about and it's this:-
On the 27th December 1823 a boat called the Hornby set sail from Liverpool for Rio de Janeiro. She had a crew of 13 and 2 passengers and a cargo valued at £60,000.00 but was shipwrecked off a cove on the Great Orme when a great storm raged.  All aboard the ship perished apart from one crewman called John Williams and part of the ship was forced by the sea into a small opening in the rocks and remained stuck there for many years.
In 1824,  soldiers of the Welsh Regiment were ordered to Llandudno to guard the wreck and were billeted at the Kings Head Inn but they were unable to prevent Llandudno’s enthusiastic looters stripping the ship’s cargo of cloth.  Nevertheless they tracked down the main culprits and marched them off to Caernarfon.
Twenty four villagers were arraigned on the charge of “Theft of cloth following the shipwreck of the Hornby” and eleven people were subsequently imprisoned.   
This is where John Roberts comes in as he was imprisoned for 6 months with hard labour.
There are many John Roberts’ about now but in 1801 the population of Llandudno was only 301 and that obviously included men,women and children so I would think that there weren't many John Roberts' about then.
 Was he a relative? well who knows.
I believe that there is a facility on the computer that can give information about people with a criminal past but I'm not sure how to find it. Dwsi and Suepp are both very good at finding things and may be able to help if this person turns out to be a relative,   

[dwsi]

National Library of Wales: Crime and Punishment : Search Results http://bit.ly/rFb8NV

Accused John Roberts;
Parish: Llandudno; County: Caernarfon;
Status: Labourer
Offence Theft of cloth following the shipwreck of the Hornby, belonging to Joseph Hornby the elder, Thomas Hornby, William Hornby, Hugh Hornby, Joseph Hornby the younger, Hornby Roughsedge, John Fisher, prosecutor and others.
Location and date Parish: Llandudno; County: Caernarfon; Date: 24 February 1824
Prosecutor James Aikin, Liverpool, co. Lancs., merchan
Plea Not guilty.
Verdict Guilty.
Punishment 6 months imprisonment with hard labour in the House of Correction
File number 4/282/1
Document number 63
Other documents B, J

[emma p]

Oooh i say......a rebel in our midst !!!!!
Thanks dwsi.....its been driving me mad all afternoon.  without any dates of birth etc we have no way of knowing. Did notice Messrs Thomas and William Roberts too !!!

[dwsi]

Criminal Register for 1824 Record for John Roberts (5^th down the page)

[emma p]

Wow.....
 

[DaveR]

Good work, Dwsi! 

[Hugo]

I was reading Christopher Draper's book last night called "Llandudno before the hotels" and as the early Roberts family were members of the Baptist Chapels I thought that Chapter 15 of the book may be of interest.
Chapter 15 is headed Declining Church and Aspiring Chapel and says that in 1800 the only place of worship in Llandudno was at St Tudno's Church on the other side of the Great Orme. It goes on to say that in 1776 Baptist missionaries from South Wales established a Chapel at Fforddlas near Glan Conwy and Robert Roberts spearheaded attempts to carry the faith to Llandudno. Because of their publicly demonstrated commitment to whole body immersion, villagers disparagingly referred to these Baptists emissaries as "Dippers"     
In 1789 Robert Roberts began preaching from the yard in the Hen Dafarn, the old tavern just below Rofft Bach.   It goes on to say that in 1799 Robert Roberts baptised Owen Williams in the sea at West Shore and John Roberts of Ty'n y Ffrith recorded the ceremony.  Now this John Roberts may be the one previously mentioned but I've no way of finding out.    Ty'n Y Ffrith was a small holding (later a mini golf course and now a block of apartments) that was situated between Venue Cymru and the Washington Hotel.  The occupants of Ty'n y Ffrith were the only ones who refused to move from their property when Lord Mostyn legally stole the land and houses from the people of Llandudno. 

[Hugo]

Richard Roberts Obituary

[emma p]

Good one Hugo. 
Who was Griffith ??

[Hugo]

Griffith Roberts was the local undertaker but I don't know if he was related to your side of the family. I'm sure that someone on here will know more about the firm than I do.

[emma p]

Im sure Jane has mentioned a Griffith.........it also says 'of Jubilee Street' next to his name So either Griffith is a relative or the funeral directors is in Jubilee St.
Does 'surviving Mr.Roberts are two brothers' mean that there are two brothers left ? We know that Robert dies later in 1961 so from that i presume Owen is still alive ?
Mmmmm. Where is Owen ? Jane and i have checked WW1 graves and he's not there.
Think a phonecall to the cemetery again may be in order......but without a date or age etc may be tricky.
We know that Evan is married and in Vadre Cottages and Lewis is a postman.....somewhere !! Gotta find their dates of death and burial place.