great orme cemetery

[DaveR]

This is a very interesting pic, where did you find it, Dwsi? Any others?

I'm still minded that the white cottage at extreme left is Roft Bach. The remaining cottage at Wyddfyd is very similar to the ones in the right of the old photo.

[emma p]

So Dave, do you think that this cottage is Rofft Bach or is this a picture of the Wyddfyd ?
Unfortunately im back to work tomorrow.....been off for 6wks so shouldnt complain. Its the same every September...new term, new children etc.
I will still do what i can towards our search. Hopefully i can start the Wednesbury side soon and find out what happened to 'Annie' but to be honest im more interested in Johns brothers and sisters whose descendents are surely walking around Llandudno today.
Looking forward to what this week brings ? 

[DaveR]

No, this is a pic of Wyddfyd Cottage up at the Ski Slope. I just put it up to illustrate what the old cottages looked like, as its the only surviving one. 

[emma p]

Its very beautiful and very much how i evisage Rofft Bach.

[Nemesis]

Found this whilst looking for something else

[SDQ]

That proves conclusively that Rofft Bach was where the trams cross as those are the cottages in the earlier picture. Great find Nemesis.

[DaveR]

Excellent find, Nemesis. I suspect I may have that book, too!

So that little track running in front of Rofft Bach will be roughly what is now Llwynon Road.

[Nemesis]

Thanks folks-- I was amazed to just see it in front of my eyes.
The book is called Around Llandudno in old photographs and it is by Mike Hitches. The pic is on page 47.
It was one of the 'cheapos' from somewhere--I have had it for yonks, but unearthed it took look for a pic showing our house.

[Hugo]

That book's a good find Nemesis. Are there any more gems in there?   
The photo of Rofft Bach though does not match any of the properties in the photo submitted by Dwsi of the Black Gate area and we know that Rofft Bach was built where Rofft Place is now.         

[DaveR]

It's at left centre of this one, Hugo, it matches even down to the small skylight in the roof:

[smg id=2546]

[Hugo]

Dave, you're spot on with that it matches exactly.   

I was trying to picture where Rofft Place is now and just looked at the 3  houses on the top left of Dwsi's photo.  I'm more confused now by the location from where the photo of Black Gate was taken from.

[Hugo]

Emma, I went to the Library today and got some more info from the Ancestry website for you.
The 1871 Census shows that living at Ty y  Felin ( The Mill House ) Glanwydden were Richard Roberts,Ann,Evan,William and Ellen.  Their ages were 53, 38, 10, 8 and 6 respectively.
Enoch was not on it because as we know already he had left home and was working at Bodafon Farm.
Ty y Felin  is very near Pendyffryn and in 1871 living at one of the houses in Pendyffryn were William and Ann Roberts with their 6 children while at the other house in Pendyffryn were Benjamin Roberts a retired farmer aged 74 and his 52 year old wife Ann.
These Roberts' are everywhere!

Anyway I wanted to find Richard Roberts on the 1841 Census and out of 117 entries I found your Richard Roberts.  What you must remember in the 1841 Census that anyone over the age of 15 had their ages rounded down to the nearest 5 years.   What I found surprised me, it's like deja vu. In the 1841 Census and living at Pendyffryn in Glanwydden were Enoch Roberts a widower aged 60 and Elianor Roberts also aged 60 ( it did not state the relationship to Enoch )  AND Richard Roberts aged 20 an agricultural labourer.  Now Richard's age would have been 24 but had been rounded down to 20 for that stupid Census of 1841.
I can't be 100% certain but I think that the 60 year old Enoch Roberts is your G G G Grandfather! 
Just to make your head spin a little bit more, in the adjoining house also called Pendyffryn were Elias Roberts aged 20 an agricultural labourer, Margaret Roberts also aged 20 and their 11 month old son called Edward but I've no way of knowing if all the Roberts' that I've mentioned are related.
I think that you need to get down to the Queens Head in Glanwydden asap and have a stiff drink because there's a lot of your history there still waiting to be found.     Z**

[emma p]

Oh my word !!!!!
You guys are just the best.  D)
What a find with the picture of Rofft Bach Nemesis......brilliant. 
Ive got in from work and reading all this has made my day.
Hugo, i think our 60yr old Enoch would be my 4xGrandfather -

Richard, John, Enoch, Richard, Enoch(senior) !!!!!!

Looking at Enoch and Elianor im thinking twins ? obviously Enochs wife has died.
The mill house.....they must have moved to here from 3, Pendyffryn and yes we have Enoch(junior) at bodafon Farm in 1871 aged 18.
Am just wondering....where is Elizabeth(Betsy). She would be 20ish by now. My thinking is she went off and got married ?? She pops up again in 1891 census with Annie aged 4. Maybe her husband dies and she goes back to her mom and dad......Annie is then, confusingly listed as a niece ? mmmmm.

My head is most definately spinning and a pint in The Queens Head would go down very nicely !
Cheers to the Roberts', one and all   

[CurlyCap]

Hi Emma, Hugo and everyone.... I've just been reading through this thread with interest as I purchased our property on the Orme last year and I have loads of paperwork relating to Rofft Place. These include the original deeds, maps, etc and I know that the four properties that are situated there now, were built around 1936.

Whilst looking at the photo of the white cottage, if this is definitely Rofft Bach, then I don't think it did stand where Rofft Place is now, as these houses overlook Llwynnon Terrace and Old Road at an angle to the bay, as opposed to facing directly down to the town, as Rofft Bach seems to do, (that's if I've viewed these old pictures correctly !)

I may be wrong but I'd love to see any other pictures of Rofft Place before the houses were built, especially if Rofft Bach Cottage was originally situated there.

Good Luck with your search Emma - this is so interesting !  ££$

[emma p]

Hi curlycap,
I see what you are saying and i must admit looking at the picture of Rofft Bach, the Orme seems to be very close behind it. Compared to the 'black gate' picture the Orme is further away but the cottage is exactly the same, and as dave says, even down to the skylight !!!!!
Very confusing.....but very, very wonderful.
Have you looked in the gallery on here......the best set of Llandudno pictures you could ever wish for ! 

What we really all need is a time travelling machine.