Legal Matters.

[Fester]

On this thread, we can share and discuss (without prejudice) any matters of a legal nature.

Also, perhaps seek advice from other Forum members who may have had similar experiences and problems in their time.

[DaveR]

We need to make it clear that individuals/businesses etc should not be specifically named in any post on this thread. 

[Fester]

I would like to kick this off with the subject of WILLS.

I have been lucky in that I have never suffered a bereavement of someone close enough,who has left me a will to sort out.
My brother passed away, and I handled his pension and disbursements to his children, but that was very easy. There was no other estate.

However, my Mother has lost a sister 2 months ago... and she plus 2 other family members have been nominated as executors of the will.

It is a simple matter of sharing out a sum of money accross approximately 10 family members. No property or anything else involved.
However, my Mum, my Uncle and the bereaved husband (all three of them around the age of 80)..have been to many meetings with the solictors now, and are getting quite distressed.
This week, they were sent to a seperate meeting with a Commissioner of Oaths, where they swore certain vows, and then returned once again to the solicitor.
After all these meetings, my Mum asked the Solicitor, 'are we getting to the end of this process now?''
The answer was given,  ''No, this is only the beginning''   I think that all three of my relatives are losing the will to continue.

My Mum has asked me not to get involved personally at this stage,  but I was wondering if any Forum members have had similar issues in the past, or knew what the straighforward process is for disbursing the assets in a will?

I don't stand to benefit from this, but I think that this process is making my family members have to suffer the bereavement over and over again.

[Fester]

We need to make it clear that individuals/businesses etc should not be specifically named in any post on this thread. 

Indeed, I see it as a general advice topic... such things as parking fines etc could be discussed here.
It can never give definitive answers to specific cases, but it may well help members avoid lengthy processes and costs.

[suepp]

A member of my family has just been through a bereavement, the Will was very straightforward with  about 25 named individuals receiving a set amount each. The process has taken 6 months with much swearing of oaths, signing of bits of paper that have to be sent to each executor in turn, phone calls, closing of bank accounts, insurances etc. and letters backwards and forwards. I took on the task of finding out everyones full names and addresses and supplied the list to the solicitor which was helpful - even so two of the parties moved house before the end of the process. Worked out fine in the end, the only delays being  bank holidays and solicitors being absent during the process. Just make sure you have all the relevent bits of paper to show the solicitors at the first meeting.

[Yorkie]

I would like to kick this off with the subject of WILLS.

Depending on the complexity of the Will there is not always a need to employ a Solicitor.    A lot of useful information is available on the Government Web site at:

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Governmentcitizensandrights/Death/Preparation/DG_10029468

[Bri Roberts]

Fester, do you think the solicitor is dragging matters out to increase his/her fee while the funds build up interest in his/her clients' account ?

[Fester]

I did suspect exactly that Bri.
Until I read Suepp's experience.

Maybe the process just takes longer than I expected, and it is the norm.
I like Yorkie's advice.  Avoid solicitors wherever possible.

Its like the old joke.... I saw my solicitor in the street the other day, I said hello to him, and he sent me a bill !


 

[Ian]

When my father died I had to obtain Probate;  that's where the court awards the right to deal with and dispose of the deceased's assets. I was required to produce a will and appear before a high court judge, where my own identity was examined, my relationship to the deceased and so on.  Having satisfied themselves that I was my father's son and also the named executor, I was awarded probate, which acted as a magic wand. Once the banks, insurance companies, share dealing services, Lloyds, post offices, etc. saw the probate order, I was given unrestricted access to all the assets to dispose of as I wished.

The point I'm making is that there was both a will and an executor in the form of me, but it was not an easy process even then. In your case, there are several executors, but it should be pointed out that the elderly ones can decline the role and pass the responsibility to a single executor, which makes it somewhat easier.

[Bri Roberts]

I was given unrestricted access to all the assets to dispose of as I wished.

Ian, whilst I agree with everything else you have stated in your post, should you not have distributed the assets in accordance with the wishes of the deceased?

[Ian]

I did, Brian, and that's of course what the executor has to do.  the granting of probate just makes the entire process - which is pretty long-winded, anyway - a great deal easier. When I used the phrase as I wished" I ought to have clarified it by saying that I obviously had to ensure the estate was properly distributed.  Inheritance tax, of course, is the thing you have to deal with first.

[Fester]

Thank you Ian, that is very interesting to me.

Basically my Mum is one of three executors, and I think it would indeed have been easier if she had handled it alone.
Instead, the main driver is my Uncle (a very proud man of 88 years old) but I fear that he is reluctant to let the other two executors take any real control of the process.

So, from what has been said, it does indeed seem to be a lengthy process. One that is designed to by water tight, but also have the benefit of making the lawyers richer.

Another point to note is that my Mum had probate for another will in the past.  She was able to exercise a bit of 'license' shall we say, with regard to the deceased's assets.
She didn't change the sums or the beneficiaries, but she did hold on to the sums of money until she deemed that the recipients were fit to recieve it.  Eight years on, two of those people are still waiting!!    A bit judgemental at times, my old Mum.

[Bri Roberts]

Its like the old joke.... I saw my solicitor in the street the other day, I said hello to him, and he sent me a bill !

Consider yourself lucky, Fester, he did not have to cross the road to say his “hello”. 

Seriously, I was a co-executor for the will of my late mother-in-law.

The other executor was the senior partner in a local firm of solicitors who knew me very well and he suggested I went ahead and did everything myself.

Not only was it an interesting challenge for me but it turned out much cheaper and probably quicker because there was only me dealing with the matter.

[Fester]

Thanks for all your contributions...

I was also wondering, that once you have written a will, no matter how clear and concise you have been...and then had it witnessed (not by any beneficiaries) ... I am told that it is still not legally binding?

This issue of wills, it seems to be more of a minefield than I ever thought possible.

[Ian]

That's right.  The two big problems with wills are state of mind while writing them (which includes whether the deceased was unduly influenced by others while writing it)  and whether the one that appears to be the most recent is actually the most recent.  And wills can be challenged by close relatives who feel they've been denied their share. Intestacy's no better, mind you.

The will is really little more than a series of instructions as to how the deceased would like their estate to be distributed.  In the case of most wills, apparently, they're unchallenged and normally go through without many problems.