Members' Lounge > Politics & Current Affairs

National Health Service

(1/115) > >>

Fester:
Two reasons for posting this article,

1, The failings of the NHS24 emergency telephone helpline are starkly exposed here, and have caused the premature and needless death of this poor man from Scotland.

2, I couldn't help but notice that the picture of him favoured by his family, has him on the Llandudno Cable Car.

See here..  http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-24456142

Ian:
If you read the full account, it's interesting, since it indicates very clearly several things.  The NHS 'helpline' was always doomed to fail, because it intersperses a human being between the patient and the advice. When you ring the helpline they 'tick boxes on (their) computer screen' and - in this case - some of the wrong boxes were ticked. If the human had been removed, then it would have been down to the patient to tick those same boxes.

Secondly, the helpline is designed to ward off the 'imaginatively ill' and direct the really ill to the appropriate (and increasingly overwhelmed) resources. Triage is difficult to do at a distance and still difficult to do in person.

Thirdly, whenever a sick person is face-to-face with any medical professional two discrete skills are brought into play: physical diagnosis through examination and taking history, through communication. The latter is essentially a process whereby the patient has to convince the Doctor of the seriousness of the condition and with some patients (and some Doctors) that's not an easy process.

I'm not sure the failings in this case actually "caused the premature and needless death of this poor man from Scotland.".  That may well have contributed, but Septicaemia isn't something from which you easily walk away and it's noteworthy that 'he concealed the extent of the illness from his family' for 24 hours because he didn't want to spoil their Christmas. Laudable as that was, without prompt medical attention that condition is often fatal.

born2run:
Has anyone ever used the NHS website for diagnosis? Whenever I have typed my symptons into that it has told me to rin and ambulance straight away

Fester:

--- Quote from: Ian on October 10, 2013, 07:46:48 am ---If you read the full account, it's interesting, since it indicates very clearly several things.  The NHS 'helpline' was always doomed to fail, because it intersperses a human being between the patient and the advice. When you ring the helpline they 'tick boxes on (their) computer screen' and - in this case - some of the wrong boxes were ticked. If the human had been removed, then it would have been down to the patient to tick those same boxes.


I'm not sure the failings in this case actually "caused the premature and needless death of this poor man from Scotland.".  That may well have contributed, but Septicaemia isn't something from which you easily walk away and it's noteworthy that 'he concealed the extent of the illness from his family' for 24 hours because he didn't want to spoil their Christmas. Laudable as that was, without prompt medical attention that condition is often fatal.

--- End quote ---

The first thing to point out, is that (subject to the enquiry) it seem that SEVERAL human beings made critical errors. One is understandable, even foregiveable.  But several???  That smacks of very poor management, training, process, or a combination of all three.

On the point of whether you believe that this case 'caused' his needless death, that will be decided by the enquiry.
All I know is, if that was one of my nearest and dearest, I would be mightily angry about the fact that he laid there, seeking help whilst suffering, and it could have been prevented.

Ian:

--- Quote ---All I know is, if that was one of my nearest and dearest, I would be mightily angry about the fact that he laid there, seeking help whilst suffering, and it could have been prevented.
--- End quote ---

Well, I wasn't disagreeing with your assessment, F;  I was simply observing that the NHS incongruously named 'helpline' was always going to be an accident waiting to happen.

More seriously, perhaps had he thought to mention to his family how badly he was suffering, then something might have been done. 24 hours with Septicaemia and no treatment isn't recommended.   

Actually, I've long thought we've reached a point where distance treatment could be done.  There are several things that make this viable.

Most people who visit GPs don't need to. Most GPs have no idea what's wrong with their patients most of the time. Most people will (and do) get better by themselves. A small number of people rigorously abuse the system. A self-diagnostic program on your computer will usually do the job as well as or better than your GP.

We could slash NHS spending in three ways: refuse treatment to those with self-inflicted conditions - which includes falling over when drunk, drugged or self-incapacitated.
Institute rigorously-manned Triage points at A&E units.
Make visiting the GP an unpleasant experience by - say, chilling all waiting rooms by having all windows open all the time. That's why dentists aren't as overrun as GPs claim to be. No one enjoys visiting the dentist, so they only go when they have to. But too many local surgeries are simply social clubs for the local over-80s nudist clog dancing and low altitude free fall parachute clubs.

Note:  some of the above is in jest.
 

Navigation

[0] Message Index

[#] Next page