Author Topic: Policing Issues Discussion  (Read 34126 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Ian

  • Administrator
Re: Policing Issues Discussion
« Reply #15 on: July 29, 2011, 08:57:20 AM »
Quote
I ain't frightened of ID cards or CCTV either.... only those with something to hide should be.

This is the argument always used by those who believe the state should have unlimited and total power to know everything about everyone.  And, just so long as the servants of the state - every civil servant, every police officer, every employee of the government - are paragons of virtue, would never be tempted to use information for their own ends, never lose memory sticks, discs, laptops, leave them on trains, buses, 'planes, boats, libraries, always encrypt every single bit of information, then the system should work just fine. Shortly, unless you take specific steps to refuse, your medical history and details will be available to millions of civil servants, so - as long as you don't mind your neighbours knowing your most intimate details, then let's go ahead and put everyone on a huge database.
“Nothing is so firmly believed as that which we least know.”   ― Michel de Montaigne

Si hoc legere scis, nimis eruditionis habes.

Merddin Emrys

  • Ad Free Member
  • *
Re: Policing Issues Discussion
« Reply #16 on: July 29, 2011, 10:23:09 AM »
I've always been dead against identity cards and do not want my dna or fingerprints on any government database, who knows what you could be fitted up for!  The professional criminals will always get around these measures, they just cause hassle for ordinary folk

Trust no one!  aaa.gif
A pigeon is for life not just Christmas

PC Mike Smith

  • Member
  • 07800991219
Re: Policing Issues Discussion
« Reply #17 on: July 29, 2011, 10:54:35 AM »
Pendragon,
the fingerprinting we do with the children are all done using ink pads and paper only.

Trojan

  • Member
Re: Policing Issues Discussion
« Reply #18 on: July 29, 2011, 11:07:29 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Pendragon,
the fingerprinting we do with the children are all done using ink pads and paper only.

Then the children take the papers with their fingerprints home with them as souvenirs.  :D

Pendragon

  • Member
Re: Policing Issues Discussion
« Reply #19 on: July 29, 2011, 11:10:23 AM »
Good luck with it Mike I hope it goes well.   $good$

If I was a kid I'd like to do some forensic testing, you know like a bit of detective work using the magnetic powder to find out "who done it" (who am I kidding I'd like to do that now)  ;D
Only hindsight has 20/20 vision
Angiegram - A romantic notion derived from the more mundane truth.

Truth is, everybody is going to hurt you; you just gotta find the ones worth suffering for." -Bob Marley

PC Mike Smith

  • Member
  • 07800991219
Re: Policing Issues Discussion
« Reply #20 on: July 29, 2011, 11:14:45 AM »
Yes Trojan that is right.the prints are done on a small piece of card which goes into a keyring which the children take home.

Pendragon

  • Member
Re: Policing Issues Discussion
« Reply #21 on: July 29, 2011, 11:16:40 AM »
Could be handy when you want to know who went in the penny jar  ;)
Only hindsight has 20/20 vision
Angiegram - A romantic notion derived from the more mundane truth.

Truth is, everybody is going to hurt you; you just gotta find the ones worth suffering for." -Bob Marley



Trojan

  • Member
Re: Policing Issues Discussion
« Reply #22 on: July 29, 2011, 11:36:16 AM »
Let's get some policing issues going!  :)

Mike, how is the force re-structuring that took place in May coming along?

Have there been any noticeable benefits?

With regard to crime statistics, I should think that it's a little early at present to see any noticeable differences?

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login   

Hugo

  • Ad Free Member
  • *
Re: Policing Issues Discussion
« Reply #23 on: July 29, 2011, 10:40:42 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Do you know what?
I would be very happy to have my kids fingerprints kept on a database,
So that if they got up to mischief in future, they would get their come-uppance...

I ain't frightened of ID cards or CCTV either.... only those with something to hide should be.



Fester, I've got to admire you because you say it as it is.  I'll also go along with Pendragon too.  If there was a DNA data base set up on every one, it would solve a lot of problems in the future.
In fact I'd go one step further and introduce a lie detector test as part of the evidence.  So many millions of pounds are wasted on Court cases by the Legal Profession who appear to be seeking to line their pockets rather than trying to obtain justice.
A simple question that requires a yes or no answer will in the long run save a lot of time and money.
I know that there are those that will argue against this but every one is entitled to their opinion. 

Fester

  • Ad Free Member.
  • *
  • El Baldito
Re: Policing Issues Discussion
« Reply #24 on: July 29, 2011, 11:26:18 PM »
Indeed Hugo.
It might not be entirely palatable to have all our details known to a central power...
But, (and its a BIG but)... anyone who argues against the relatively slight risk of our details being misused, are totally underestimating the threat of terrorism for one.  But also the colossal and chronic crimewave being perpetrated by those infiltrating our country from Eastern Europe and Asian countries.

If I thought that someone might misplace my details, but we could stop every crime and terror threat... then I'll take my chances thank you!
Fester...
- Semper in Excretum, Sole Profundum Variat -

Ian

  • Administrator
Re: Policing Issues Discussion
« Reply #25 on: July 30, 2011, 10:16:59 AM »
Quote
anyone who argues against the relatively slight risk of our details being misused, are totally underestimating the threat of terrorism for one.  But also the colossal and chronic crimewave being perpetrated by those infiltrating our country from Eastern Europe and Asian countries.

So you see the "threat of terrorism' as being greater than the "the relatively slight risk of our details being misused"?  So, clearly, more lives are ruined through terrorism than data theft and fraud?  You should read the Home Office Crime Stats:

# There were 125 terrorism arrests in the past twelve months,thirty-four per cent of which arrests resulted in a charge, of which only 50% were terrorism related.

In its January 2011 report the NFA estimates that fraud cost the UK around £38.4 billion in 2009 - an average of £765 for each adult member of the UK population.

Convictions for fraud last year alone were 767,000.

Sounds to me like Fraud affects a lot more people.
“Nothing is so firmly believed as that which we least know.”   ― Michel de Montaigne

Si hoc legere scis, nimis eruditionis habes.

Ian

  • Administrator
Re: Policing Issues Discussion
« Reply #26 on: July 30, 2011, 10:21:01 AM »
Quote
I'd go one step further and introduce a lie detector test as part of the evidence.

There are good reasons why even the USA  is extremely wary about polygraph evidence in most states and we don't allow it at all, Hugo.  It's essentially unreliable, and can be fooled once you know how to do it.  Oh, and Psychopaths and Sociopaths don't register, apparently.  Polygraphs work only if the person being tested is nervous, and that's never going to happen when someone is wrongly accused, of course...  :)
“Nothing is so firmly believed as that which we least know.”   ― Michel de Montaigne

Si hoc legere scis, nimis eruditionis habes.

Hugo

  • Ad Free Member
  • *
Re: Policing Issues Discussion
« Reply #27 on: July 30, 2011, 10:34:58 AM »
Thanks Mike for giving me the details of the Colwyn Heights Community Police, I have already been in touch regarding a matter that has arisen here.

Hugo

  • Ad Free Member
  • *
Re: Policing Issues Discussion
« Reply #28 on: July 30, 2011, 11:02:09 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Quote
I'd go one step further and introduce a lie detector test as part of the evidence.

There are good reasons why even the USA doesn't is extremely wary about polygraph evidence in most states and we don't allow it at all, Hugo.  It's essentially unreliable, and can be fooled once you know how to do it.  Oh, and Psychopaths and Sociopaths don't register, apparently.  Polygraphs work only if the person being tested is nervous, and that's never going to happen when someone is wrongly accused, of course...  :)

Yes, of course it's not 100% reliable but it could be used as circumstantial evidence. If anyone is desperate to prove their innocence why wouldn't they ask for the test.  Experienced Police officers have a knack of detecting the criminal element but it must be frustrating for them when interviewing suspects and know that the suspects are lying through their teeth but unfortunately the Police do not have enough evidence to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that the suspect is guilty.

Ian

  • Administrator
Re: Policing Issues Discussion
« Reply #29 on: July 30, 2011, 11:16:00 AM »
I'm not 100% sure but I seem to remember something about a defendant having his own test done, and using that as part of the defence.
“Nothing is so firmly believed as that which we least know.”   ― Michel de Montaigne

Si hoc legere scis, nimis eruditionis habes.