Author Topic: Covid restrictions enforcement  (Read 87341 times)

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Offline Dave

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Re: Covid restrictions enforcement
« Reply #195 on: May 30, 2020, 02:06:18 pm »
There is no doubt in my mind that Cummings had no regard for any of the rules and having been caught out should have done the decent thing and resigned. Like those who have come and gone before him he could soon be reappointed and eventually sit in the Lords alongside Lord Mandelson.

As for having a liar running the country, well wouldn't be the first would he, either here or in many other countries either. If it was he who moulded the policies this government was elected on, and elected by a huge majority too, then a lot of people would be disappointed if they weren't followed through. He has no doubt made many enemies along the way, particularly in the press it seems, and they are now delighting in the chance to kick him. Might bring him down a peg or two but that's about all. I think you probably have to have an unpleasant side to your character to get to the top in so many areas of life and he's no exception.

Offline Blongb

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Re: Covid restrictions enforcement
« Reply #196 on: May 30, 2020, 05:21:42 pm »
He should have put his hands up, paid his £60 fine and that would have been the end of the matter. He's not an elected official, so why should he resign.  $booboo$
Quot homines tot sententiae: suus cuique mos.
(There are as many opinions as there are people: each has his own view.)


Offline Dave

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Re: Covid restrictions enforcement
« Reply #197 on: May 31, 2020, 10:44:14 am »
He should have put his hands up, paid his £60 fine and that would have been the end of the matter. He's not an elected official, so why should he resign.  $booboo$

 I might be incorrect but I haven't seen any reference to him being fined, the police investigated the matter too. There have been many issued with fines for similar or possibly even lesser breaches of the rules. That is what probably does more to antagonise the masses than anything.
Let's be honest, how many people can put their hand on heart and say they haven't bent the rules themselves ? I doubt there are many who can.

Offline Ian

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Re: Covid restrictions enforcement
« Reply #198 on: May 31, 2020, 11:33:24 am »
That's true, but then I doubt most were involved at the top of government in formulating messages such as "Stay Home" and "Protect the NHS".

The difference in how Cummings perceives himself and his indispensability is clear when you look at the Prof Neil Ferguson case. It's worth comparing the two.

Ferguson runs the group of scientists at Imperial College London whose projections helped persuade ministers of the need to impose stringent physical distancing rules, or risk the NHS being overwhelmed. Ferguson's breach was simply that his lover visited him twice, and she travelled across London to do it.

Within moments of the revelations in the Telegraph, Cabinet minsters called on him to resign, which he did. Note, however, that apart from initially attending SAGE meetings, Ferguson hadn't actually left his house, and was not suffering from Covid. But still cabinet ministers thought he should go.

Cummings case is very, very different. On the day Cummings ran out of No 10, his wife, Mary Wakefield, appears to have been already ill, according to her Spectator article about the experience, in which she says: “My husband did rush home to look after me.” The article did not mention that soon after he rushed home, the family went to the other end of the country.

Wakefield wrote that Cummings said “I feel weird” and collapsed 24 hours after he came home to look after her, placing their journey north on Friday – perhaps trying to beat the weekend getaway – or Saturday at the latest.

In its defence of Cummings, No 10 said the couple had had to travel north in search of childcare from Cummings’s sister and nieces at the property owned by his parents. But, in the end, Cummings and his wife did not need childcare, No 10 have said, instead relying on the family to deliver food to their door.

The Barnard Castle sighting was also interesting.  Would a journey to a popular day-trip destination on a loved one’s birthday, 30 miles from the lockdown location, constitute essential travel or compliance with the government’s “stay home” instruction?

In a piece for the Spectator, the magazine she works for, Wakefield wrote: “We emerged from quarantine into the almost comical uncertainty of London lockdown.” No clarification, however, that they had actually emerged into the capital from Durham.

The eyesight issue is also interesting. Cummings claimed to have driven to BC to 'test his eyesight'. If Cummings had concerns over whether his eyesight was good enough to drive to London, why was he confident enough to drive 30 miles to Barnard Castle, with his wife and son in the vehicle? And as a top government advisor, does he know that driving with impaired vision is illegal?

Cummings said that he took a walk in the second week of his stay in Durham “after I started to recover”. That would suggest he still had some symptoms. The Public Health England guidance on outdoor exercise changed that week and by 9 April all outdoor exercise was prohibited for those with symptoms. So when exactly did the walk take place?

There's a great deal more, such as him not being able to remember whether the family had stopped either on the way  to Durham or on their return.  Witnesses were able to confirm that they certainly did stop in BC and went for a walk.

So while it's pretty conclusive that he is a stranger to the truth, and that he considers himself above the law, unlike Ferguson there have been few calls for him to resign by cabinet ministers.

Why should he resign?

Well, in true Wizard of Oz style he's the person pulling the strings and government and politics should be about trust. When someone has so brazenly proved that they can't be trusted is it right, ethically and morally, that they continue in a role which has such far-reaching consequences for all of us?


Nothing is so firmly believed as that which we least know.  ― Michel de Montaigne

Si hoc legere scis, nimis eruditionis habes.

Offline Dave

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Re: Covid restrictions enforcement
« Reply #199 on: May 31, 2020, 02:55:42 pm »
In my opinion you are absolutely right Ian both in the probable detail of the story and your conclusion he should resign. We should have people that are trustworthy running the country but the simple truth is those who get to the top tend to be ruthless and will walk over others to get there.To them the truth is often irrelevant, lying is a means to an end and not an evil. The Spin Doctor was an invention of those of this ilk.
If Cummings went he wouldn't be replaced by a saint I don't suppose.

Offline Ian

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Re: Covid restrictions enforcement
« Reply #200 on: May 31, 2020, 03:52:48 pm »
Yep;  that's the real problem.
Nothing is so firmly believed as that which we least know.  ― Michel de Montaigne

Si hoc legere scis, nimis eruditionis habes.

Offline SteveH

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Re: Covid restrictions enforcement
« Reply #201 on: May 31, 2020, 04:46:07 pm »
This makes a lot of sense.

Offline Hugo

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Re: Covid restrictions enforcement
« Reply #202 on: May 31, 2020, 11:19:17 pm »
Another idiot coming over the border.    I just hope that the car was seized as the driver failed the drug test and had no licence


https://www.dailypost.co.uk/news/north-wales-news/driver-oldham-who-flew-past-18340236

Offline Hugo

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Re: Covid restrictions enforcement
« Reply #203 on: June 01, 2020, 09:40:25 am »

Offline Dave

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Re: Covid restrictions enforcement
« Reply #204 on: June 01, 2020, 05:52:54 pm »
This makes a lot of sense.

Well if our economy goes down the tubes that's the end of life as we know it so of course businesses are opening to try and save it. What's the alternative?

Offline Fester

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Re: Covid restrictions enforcement
« Reply #205 on: June 02, 2020, 12:10:24 am »
Another point regarding Cummings which has been missed I think.
During his rose garden embarrassment of a press conference,  he made some mealy mouthed comments about feeling that his family were not safe in London, as many people knew his address, so he set off to Durham.
But, if that was true, why the hell did he drive them back there, at the height of the issue?
Utter lies.
Fester...
- Semper in Excretum, Sole Profundum Variat -

Offline Hugo

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Re: Covid restrictions enforcement
« Reply #206 on: June 02, 2020, 10:58:21 am »
The message has obviously not got through to some covidiots


https://www.dailypost.co.uk/news/north-wales-news/man-who-drove-60-miles-18347752

Offline DVT

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Re: Covid restrictions enforcement
« Reply #207 on: June 02, 2020, 11:22:33 am »
It amazes me just how many are being caught and are doing something illegal other than breakdown lockdown rules - whethere it be drugs, no tax, no insurance, and suchlike.  Makes you wonder just how many suich people are on the road during normal times and not getting hauled in.

Offline Ian

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Re: Covid restrictions enforcement
« Reply #208 on: June 02, 2020, 12:03:33 pm »
When I was learning to drive, my instructor told me never to forget that you never knew what the other driver was thinking, or how they'd react. How true that was.
Nothing is so firmly believed as that which we least know.  ― Michel de Montaigne

Si hoc legere scis, nimis eruditionis habes.

Offline Hugo

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Re: Covid restrictions enforcement
« Reply #209 on: June 02, 2020, 12:27:30 pm »
It amazes me just how many are being caught and are doing something illegal other than breakdown lockdown rules - whethere it be drugs, no tax, no insurance, and suchlike.  Makes you wonder just how many suich people are on the road during normal times and not getting hauled in.


DVT.   I think that I mentioned to you before in a PM  about the Car Tax Checker,  it's a link that gives you the info whether a car has  valid tax or MOT on it.
The DVLA has this information and it is automatically renewed on a daily basis so they have this information readily available.
Since the abolition of the paper road tax disc the number of offenders has rocketed and I wanted some info from them as I wanted to prove that as an enforcement recovery office they were not fit for purpose
Under the FOI  Act  I asked the following questions:-
On a specified date how many vehicles:-
1)     Had tax that had expired
2)     Had a MOT that had expired
3)      Had a SORN

I did have a reply and they refused to answer the questions and said that they would not respond to me in the future as they had previously supplied the info ( which they had not )  to me
The amount of lost revenue is staggering and is well in excess of £100M   but I think that they have something to hide.   It's not the fault of the staff but of the system of enforcement that they have to abide by