Author Topic: European Union Vote  (Read 61253 times)

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DaveR

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Re: European Union Vote
« Reply #420 on: April 24, 2019, 12:15:41 PM »
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But it wasn't a democratic vote, in that the majority of eligible voters didn't vote to leave.

And I have to wonder why the Leave campaign people are so terrified of another referendum. Don't they believe in democracy?
That’s a really weak argument and not one I suspect you would have used in the event of a Remain victory by the same amount?  ))*

I was interested to see the Daily Post’s recent Poll on voting intentions in the event of a European Election. 3,800 people have voted:

Brexit Party 45%
Liberal Democrats 17%
Change UK 8%
Plaid Cymru 7%
Labour 7%
UKIP 5%
Conservatives 1%

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I’ve seen the comment made more than a few times lately that, if you believe in democracy then it will be necessary to vote for the Brexit Party, regardless of your normal political views.


Ian

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Re: European Union Vote
« Reply #421 on: April 24, 2019, 02:26:03 PM »
 $donald$

If you believe in democracy then we need another referendum.
“Nothing is so firmly believed as that which we least know.”   ― Michel de Montaigne

Si hoc legere scis, nimis eruditionis habes.

DaveR

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Re: European Union Vote
« Reply #422 on: May 17, 2019, 09:36:45 AM »
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Quote
If you believe in democracy then we need another referendum.
...and if someone doesn’t like the result of that one, we just have another and another and another?

That's an outmoded argument and you know it :-) The reason we need another referendum is that the facts - such as they were - were not given to the voters prior to the vote, massive lies were told by the Leave campaign (remember the £350m claim?), the Vote Leave organisers have already be fined thousands over misrepresentation and breaking electoral law and we now have a much clearer idea of what Leaving would mean.

And here's the thing: Why are leavers so terrified of another vote? Doesn't seem rational, given they're so sure they'd win...

Quote
I see every poll has the Brexit Party leading by a significant majority - perhaps they’re just asking the wrong people though, Ian?

If I were a betting man I'd expect the only party with 'brexit' in its name to win, if only on the basis of statistical probability. The remain parties - just about all the others - will inevitably split the vote.

« Last Edit: May 17, 2019, 10:51:52 AM by Ian »

DaveR

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Re: European Union Vote
« Reply #423 on: May 27, 2019, 06:42:09 AM »
Er...I think you’ve edited my post rather than replying to it, Ian?  ))*

Ian

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Re: European Union Vote
« Reply #424 on: May 27, 2019, 06:55:41 AM »
Yikes!  Dave - only just seen this.  I'm so sorry.   ))*  $booboo$ And here was I about to observe that not only did the Brexit party fall far short of the predicted voting percentages but that their overall vote was around 33% whereas the percentage total votes for the other parties was around 67% - and that genuinely surprised me.

A single issue party with no manifesto other than leaving the EU would - I'd have imagined - scored significantly higher.

However we look at it, though, it's incredibly bad news for the Tories but far, far worse for Labour.  Well done the Lib Dems and the Greens.
“Nothing is so firmly believed as that which we least know.”   ― Michel de Montaigne

Si hoc legere scis, nimis eruditionis habes.

DaveR

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Re: European Union Vote
« Reply #425 on: May 27, 2019, 10:15:50 AM »
Really? If you count together all the parties who are pledged to deliver Brexit as part of their manifesto (Brexit, UKIP, Conservatives, Labour), that gives you about 57% of votes cast.

Unless you are about to say that a Remainer would vote for a party pledged to deliver Brexit?  $yes$

Ian

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Re: European Union Vote
« Reply #426 on: May 27, 2019, 12:49:07 PM »
The other parties are split, as you will know. A single issue party with no manifesto should have scooped the board - but it only managed around 33% of the votes. However, the chance of a second referendum is now looking increasingly likely, so I imagine that will sort the issue once and for all.
“Nothing is so firmly believed as that which we least know.”   ― Michel de Montaigne

Si hoc legere scis, nimis eruditionis habes.



Ian

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Re: European Union Vote
« Reply #427 on: May 27, 2019, 03:15:31 PM »
The picture is becoming a little clearer:

Pro-remain 40.4% (LD, Green, SNP, Change, Plaid)
Pro-Brexit 34.9% (Brexit and UKIP)
“Nothing is so firmly believed as that which we least know.”   ― Michel de Montaigne

Si hoc legere scis, nimis eruditionis habes.

Blongb

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Re: European Union Vote
« Reply #428 on: May 27, 2019, 03:45:44 PM »
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The picture is becoming a little clearer:

Pro-remain 40.4% (LD, Green, SNP, Change, Plaid)
Pro-Brexit 34.9% (Brexit and UKIP)

What about the % who didn't bother to vote because we're leaving Europe, if they were factored into the equation. it would paint a far more realistic picture on what the majority of the people want.  $uk
-- Now I can only sit and stare--

Ian

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Re: European Union Vote
« Reply #429 on: May 27, 2019, 05:25:45 PM »
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The picture is becoming a little clearer:

Pro-remain 40.4% (LD, Green, SNP, Change, Plaid)
Pro-Brexit 34.9% (Brexit and UKIP)

What about the % who didn't bother to vote because we're leaving Europe, if they were factored into the equation. it would paint a far more realistic picture on what the majority of the people want.  $uk

Well, that's the problem with any vote. Unless we had compulsory voting, as the Aussies do, then it's impossible to say anything with precision, other than note the final figures.  But I can't remember a time when both the so-called main parties have been in such a mess.
“Nothing is so firmly believed as that which we least know.”   ― Michel de Montaigne

Si hoc legere scis, nimis eruditionis habes.

Fester

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Re: European Union Vote
« Reply #430 on: May 27, 2019, 10:49:09 PM »
I’m glad you’ve now ignored the Labour and Conservative parties votes, because they have a lot of traditional voters who will stick with them, despite their stance on Brexit being impossible to understand.
So yes, there is a slight remain majority in the final analysis.
But I can’t get away from the fact that only a third of eligible people voted in what was essentially a pseudo referendum... and only a third of them voted for a strident Leave or Remain party.
So in reality only one in 9 of the U.K. population declared a firm view either way!

Talk about a small minority of folk making a LOT of noise!
Fester...
- Semper in Excretum, Sole Profundum Variat -

Ian

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Re: European Union Vote
« Reply #431 on: May 28, 2019, 08:58:43 AM »
More figures:

The Brexit Party - 5,248,533
UKIP -                      554,463

Total - 5,802,996


Lib Dems -  3,367,284
Greens    -  2,023,380
SNP -             594,553
Plaid Cymru - 163,928
Change UK  - 571,846

Total - 6,720,991
“Nothing is so firmly believed as that which we least know.”   ― Michel de Montaigne

Si hoc legere scis, nimis eruditionis habes.

Ian

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Re: European Union Vote
« Reply #432 on: May 28, 2019, 09:04:49 AM »
Yes; the low voting figures are worrying. Short of bringing in the Aussie model and making it compulsory, I'm not sure how that can be changed.
“Nothing is so firmly believed as that which we least know.”   ― Michel de Montaigne

Si hoc legere scis, nimis eruditionis habes.

Hugo

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Re: European Union Vote
« Reply #433 on: May 28, 2019, 10:14:45 AM »
I must admit that I'm one of those people who didn't vote in the election.    For the first time ever, I didn't know who to vote for and after 3 years this Brexit business should have been sorted out by now.

norman08

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Re: European Union Vote
« Reply #434 on: May 28, 2019, 10:26:45 AM »
I had a message just before the polling station closed and just over 550 voters had bothered out of about 2.000 + able to vote. I think people are so fed up of the lot of them.