Author Topic: Thomas and Emma WILLIAMS possibly of Caerhun  (Read 18823 times)

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Offline jom

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Re: Thomas and Emma WILLIAMS possibly of Caerhun
« Reply #30 on: March 05, 2015, 08:08:24 pm »
thanks for the tip.  Will try that $good$

Offline Hugo

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Re: Thomas and Emma WILLIAMS possibly of Caerhun
« Reply #31 on: May 08, 2015, 04:50:35 pm »
I know that it's not in the right topic but I've been on a walk today and visited the Baptist Cemetery in Glanwydden where some of your relatives are buried.
There has been some work undertaken to tidy up the old part of the Cemetery but it still needs a lot of TLC before people can really visit this spot.  The grave of Hugh Jones is the one in the first picture and doesn't look in too bad a condition but when I first saw it some time ago it was impossible to identify until I took the Ivy off it.
Even the new part of the Cemetery has taken a battering when a large branch snapped on one of the Fir trees nearby.


Offline jom

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Re: Thomas and Emma WILLIAMS possibly of Caerhun
« Reply #32 on: May 09, 2015, 12:14:59 am »
Gosh that's quite some achievement from the original photos you posted Hugo. VERY interesting.  Thank you.  Such a shame that so many cemeteries are no longer maintained.  Always grateful to folk like yourself unearthing the past.  It's certainly looking a lot better already.  Thank you for thinking of me.  Will add to my collection.  Coming to the Uk in Autumn but think time will be too tight too do a research trip but it is in my mind I must say ;)

Offline jom

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Re: Thomas and Emma WILLIAMS possibly of Caerhun
« Reply #33 on: May 09, 2015, 12:17:37 am »
Gosh that's quite some achievement from the original photos you posted Hugo. VERY interesting.  Thank you.  Such a shame that so many cemeteries are no longer maintained.  Always grateful to folk like yourself unearthing the past.  It's certainly looking a lot better already.  Thank you for thinking of me.  Will add to my collection.  Coming to the Uk in Autumn but think time will be too tight too do a research trip but it is in my mind I must say ;)

Offline Hugo

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Re: Thomas and Emma WILLIAMS possibly of Caerhun
« Reply #34 on: May 09, 2015, 03:38:26 pm »
Hope that you enjoy your trip here whatever you decide to do, but will you please bring your nice weather with you when you come here.!

Offline Hugo

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Re: Thomas and Emma WILLIAMS possibly of Caerhun
« Reply #35 on: May 11, 2015, 02:22:30 pm »
It's still a mystery of where Emma and Thomas are buried.  It is hoped that they were buried together, but where?
I can see from the posting on 17th Feb  2015 that Emma's burial is recorded as being in the Parish of Llanrwst but it does not mean that the burial was  is in Llanrwst  town itself.    The Parish covers Maenan in Caernarfonshire but will also cover Eglwysbach further north in Denbighshire and the surrounding areas around the town of Llanrwst including  Llanddoged.
There is a Cae Melwr Cemetery in Nebo Road Llanrwst that I haven't seen the records of and also two Cemeteries in Llanddoged that I haven't been able to see either.
It's just a hunch but Emma was living in Llanddoged and got married there so she had a strong connection with the village and it's possible that is where they are both  buried.
St Doged is the Church there but I've just noticed that there is Tan Y Bryn  Chapel there too.   Unfortunately the records are missing in the Archives for the Church and usually Chapel records are harder to find.
I'll have another look in the Archives when I visit there next.   I had a look at the link provided by Meleri but it didn't help unfortunately.
The Burial Indexes in the Archives provide the inscription on the headstones, the people listed alphabetically and their addresses also listed alphabetically.   It's very easy to find that way IF of course they have the books available
 

Offline jom

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Re: Thomas and Emma WILLIAMS possibly of Caerhun
« Reply #36 on: May 17, 2015, 01:12:18 am »
Cheers Hugo,
I am unable to see any connection to Llanddoget other than Emma (if we have the right marriage) was of that parish when married.  If we then stretch it further looking for an Emma EVANS of the right age we come up with an Emma EVANS of Ro, which is where my Thomas and Emma's children Mary and John were born.  Emma and Thomas as we have previously mentioned would have been quite old to be marrying for the first time.  As it is she seems to have been in her early 40s when they were born.  So it's all a little unusual ANYWAY.
I too had looked at the site from meleri's link and not found either Thomas or Emma but as you say there is another cemetery in the Llanrwst area with no records available.
When Emma died in 1860, daughter Mary was also in Llanrwst and son John was in Llandudno.  I still have no other siblings.  My gut feeling remains with Llanrwst at the moment but I too, am looking further afield.  The burial record states Llanrwst parish so presumably this includes Llanddoget?

Offline Hugo

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Re: Thomas and Emma WILLIAMS possibly of Caerhun
« Reply #37 on: May 17, 2015, 09:29:12 am »
Yes. Llanddoged is in the Parish of Llanrwst.   Emma died in Scotland Street and there is a Cemetery there but it seems that she isn't in that  one.   The other Cemetery I found was in Nebo Road which isn't that far away either but her resting place remains a mystery, for now anyway.

Offline Hugo

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Re: Thomas and Emma WILLIAMS possibly of Caerhun
« Reply #38 on: May 21, 2015, 04:18:40 pm »
I was at the Archives yesterday and had a look at all the Burial Indexes in the Conwy Valley that they have at the Archives but couldn't see anything for Emma Williams.
I found the Burial Registry for Emma that has been shown on here but there was no info on it that we are not already aware of.
The Archivist said that the person who conducted the Burial, had conducted many others and thought that it may be St Grwst Church where the burial took place but there was no evidence to prove that. that was the case or the location of the grave in the Cemetery

Offline jom

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Re: Thomas and Emma WILLIAMS possibly of Caerhun
« Reply #39 on: May 21, 2015, 11:49:02 pm »
Thank you for your continued dogedness Hugo.  Seems to be taking an interesting turn.  Great reminder that things are not as straight forward as they may seem always  :o

Offline Hugo

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Re: Thomas and Emma WILLIAMS possibly of Caerhun
« Reply #40 on: August 20, 2015, 02:23:15 pm »
I've found nothing new about the family but I am still puzzled about the missing Llanddoged Burial Index at the Archives as it still hasn't turned up.
When I questioned the lack of info about Thomas and Emma they did say that as the family lived in Denbighshire, the Archive at Ruthin may hold some info for them.  I'm not sure of the name of the office there, it may be the Clwyd Archives.
I was in Llanddoged today so I took some photos of the Church  just in case you haven't seen it.     We know that they were married there but there is no evidence of which Church or Chapel they are buried at.
There were a number of graves around 1860 and prior and although I did have a look, could find no headstone for them.
The Church is quite interesting inside  and I've not seen one like it before.  It has rows of pews on one edge but the majority of them are in small blocks in the middle of the Church and each one has a number on it.

Offline jom

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Re: Thomas and Emma WILLIAMS possibly of Caerhun
« Reply #41 on: September 21, 2015, 06:41:12 am »
Thank you for the pictures Hugo,

As you may have guessed, I haven't been doing much in the way of genealogy at the moment, and am about to fly over to Blighty tonight.  Really grateful for keeping me and my research in mind. Looks to be a lovely wee church.  I think I have come across a church set out similarly in my time but can't recall where. May have been in my childhood in the wilds of Lincolnshire, but it is certainly unusual.

Still don't know as yet if I will manage a trip to Llandudno but if time allows will certainly make the effort.

many thanks again.  I will download to add to my collection

Offline Hugo

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Re: Thomas and Emma WILLIAMS possibly of Caerhun
« Reply #42 on: September 21, 2015, 07:13:55 pm »
I hope that you have a safe flight and enjoy your stay in the UK,  it would be nice if you could bring some of your weather over here.     

Offline jom

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Re: Thomas and Emma WILLIAMS possibly of Caerhun
« Reply #43 on: January 28, 2023, 11:49:59 pm »
I have been looking for this couple off and on for a while now and since a previous comment quite some time ago in "Great Orme Cemetery", I think, I have a little more information, which may help in my search.

Thomas WILLIAMS was born probably Caernarvonshire, may be Caerhun/Rowen.  He was a shoemaker.

His wife Emma was born about 1772/75 in Caerhun as stated by census returns in 1841 and 1851.  Thomas and Emma would have married some time around 1814 or earlier having their first known child baptised in 1814 at St. Mary's in Caerhun, (I have the baptism record).  This was their daughter Mary.  They are noted as living in Ro-Wen with Thomas noted as being a shoemaker.  Their son John was similarly baptised in 1817 (I have his record too).

Son John was usually noted as being from Rowen or Caerhun on his subsequent census returns.

In 1841, Emma is found at Chapel Street, Tre Y Dre, Llanrwst, Denbighshire with Mary and John but no sign of Thomas, her husband.  By 1851 Emma is in Scotland Street, Llanrwst, Denbighshire with her daughter Mary and presumably Mary's illegitimate daughter, Mary PRITCHARD.  Emma is noted as a widow.  She died at the same address in 1860 at the stated age of 88, noted as widow of Thomas WILLIAMS, shoemaker, with son John in attendance.  She had at one time been a spinning woman.

Mary their daughter,never married as far as I can tell, dying about 1887 I believe in Llanrwst.  Mary's daughter Mary Pritchard may have married John LLOYD about 1875 in Llanrwst

John, Emma and Thomas' son married before 1865, to whom I know not and then married Martha ELLIOTT of Daventry in 1865.  He was a gardener and became the publican of the Telegraph Inn on the Orme as mentioned in other forum messages.  I still am not sure of John's whereabouts in 1851 or the identity of his first wife.

ANY snippets of information gleaned would be MOST welcome as this has been a huge brick wall for me.  I have found virtually nothing about Thomas and only what I have mentioned on Emma.  Hugo has very kindly checked Caerhun marriages for Thomas and Emma previously but was unable to find anything that fitted.  Since then, though I have more of an idea of age of Emma at least.  Keeping my fingers crossed

hi folk

it's been a while since I looked at this forum.  Hope you all are keeping well.

I'm still trying to track down Thomas WILLIAMS as above (husband of Emma EVANS) and father to Mary Bp 1812 Caerhun and John Bp 1817 Caerhun.

I am no nearer tracking Thomas' death records.  As above the 1841 census for Emma in Llanrwst makes no comment re her status (married or widowed) but in 1851 Llanrwst she IS noted a widowed.

I do have a death certificate for a Thomas of Old Road Llandudno, Shoemaker who died 1857 aged 58 but I can't find this particular chap on any census or in any directory.  My John WILLIAMS was living in Llanrwst in 1851 with his mother and sister and in 1860 was in Cwlach street, Llandudno when his mother died.  When Thomas WILLIAMS was married he is noted to be of Llanrwst

I'm running out of lateral thinking power and wondered if there were any directories for before 1841 listing him

Any ideas/ help would be much appreciated.  I haven't reposted any of the records I have but can if needed

Marriage to Emma EVANS (Llanrhychwyn)
Baptism of daughter Mary (Caerhun)
Baptism of son John (Caerhun)
1841 Census Emma and Family (Llanrwst)
1851 Cemsus Emma and Family (Emma noted as a widow) (Llanrwst)
Marriage of son John noting father as a shoemaker x 2 (Married twice) (1st marriage Llanrhychwyn, second marriage Daventry , northants) (John went on to live at the Old Telegraph Station with his second wife Martha)
Death of Emma noting thomas as a shoemaker (llanrwst)

Offline jom

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Re: Thomas and Emma WILLIAMS possibly of Caerhun
« Reply #44 on: January 30, 2023, 06:23:32 am »
Hiya.  I've just re read the whole thread here and realise the research is pretty much exhausted.  I've tried to delete this last posting but can't so please ignore and forgive
Hope all's well with everyone