Author Topic: Margaret Anne Pearl Hughes  (Read 38869 times)

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Offline Hugo

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Margaret Anne Pearl Hughes
« on: March 04, 2014, 10:23:21 pm »
Karen,    I was in the Library today and had a look at some Census records.    I'm not sure if you have this info but I'll list it below:-

The 1901 Wales Census shows the following info for people living at Elleslea  North Madoc Street  Llandudno

Ishmael  Hughes            Head    33 years      Stone Mason   born  Bolton Lancs              spoke Welsh & English
Isabel  E Hughes             wife      37 years                             born  Mountford  Salop        spoke   English
Margaret  A P Hughes    daugh                1 year                    born    Llandudno

The 1881   Wales Census   showed Ishmael  Hughes then aged 14 living and working at Tyn Y Coed  on the Great Orme   He worked for Peter C Brown a farmer of 80 acres of Tyn Y Coed Farm and Ishmail Hughes was employed as a farm servant indoor.

I couldn't trace Ishmael Hughes in the 1891  Census and didn't have time to look at the 1871 Census

Are these your relatives?       North Madoc Street is a name that no longer exists and I think that it has been renamed and may be Chapel Street but I'm not completely certain on that. 

Offline Cambrian

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Re: Margaret Anne Pearl Hughes
« Reply #1 on: March 05, 2014, 08:32:36 am »
Hugo, according to Streets of Llandudno, North Madoc Street was renamed Arvon Avenue in 1910.


Offline Hugo

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Re: Margaret Anne Pearl Hughes
« Reply #2 on: March 05, 2014, 02:43:52 pm »
Hugo, according to Streets of Llandudno, North Madoc Street was renamed Arvon Avenue in 1910.

Thanks very much for that Cambrian.     $good$

Offline Hugo

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Re: Margaret Anne Pearl Hughes
« Reply #3 on: March 13, 2014, 03:54:30 pm »
The first photo is of "Ellerslea"   Arvon Avenue ( prev North Madoc Street )  where Margaret A P Hughes lived and it's the cream coloured  house.
The second picture is where Southworth lived in 1929

Karen, do you know the middle name of your G G Grandmother  Isabel E Hughes?      Is it Emma by any chance?

The reason I ask is that in St Tudno's Church on the Great Orme at Plot No G 027 there is a grave with the headstone inscribed as follows:-

In loving memory of Harold the beloved child of Ishmael and Emma Hughes who died June 12th 1897 aged 3 years and 10 months.
Also Ishmael Hughes who died in New York Feb 8th 1916 aged 49 years.
At rest Emma Hughes who passed away 6th Aug 1945 aged 83 years.

The dates of birth are similar to the people I mentioned previously and I was wondering if  Isabel E Hughes was known as Emma Hughes.

Offline Hugo

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Re: Margaret Anne Pearl Hughes
« Reply #4 on: March 19, 2014, 03:09:47 pm »
I called at the Conwy Archives today just to check on what I had found in my last posting and what I found confirmed that Ishmael and Isabel Emma Hughes are your G Grandparents.

In the Llandudno Advertiser dated 25th Aug 1945 at page 2 is the obituary notice which read as follows:-
Hughes  Aug 6th aged 83 years Isabel (Emma) widow of Ishmael Hughes late of Quorn Villa and dear mother of Margaret ( Pearl) Southworth,  3 Olive Tree Road Wavertree  Liverpool.
Interred St Tudno's Aug 10th.

On the same page under the heading of "Thanks"  was this notice:-
Hughes-   Mrs Southworth desires to thank all relatives and friends for their kind expressions of sympathy and floral tributes in their recent sad bereavement.

Afterwards I called at the old Cemetery at St Tudno's on the Great Orme and took these photos of the grave.  It was easy to locate being next to the gate leading to the new Cemetery.

Offline karenjadejoy

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Re: Margaret Anne Pearl Hughes
« Reply #5 on: March 19, 2014, 07:45:51 pm »
Hi there Hugo,
wow many thanks for your researches,  i believe you have got the correct info.
im not permanently on internet  so sorry i was a bit long getting back to you.

so the info on harold is intersting stuff for me because i knew he had existed but nothing else apart from he died,  where and when i had no idea except infancy.  so lovely to see the pics.  and the fact that isabelle (yes Emma) is also in st tudnos.   ishmael died in New york, and is buried there as you mentioned  in the utheran cemetry he lived in the bronx in the federal 1910 census.

 he went back and forth from Llandudno to first colorado. (he and emma married there). i dont know if they knew each other previously or before they went there. first around 1888 they were married in 1890.  then later Ishmael  moved to new york. (following a falling out with his two brotheres Ted and Robert hughes. that i have no info on at all.

 Emma returned to live in Llandudno and ran boarding houses/hotels starting off in ellerslea i think.
So harold was born in Llandudno, i wasnt too sure, about that at all. great find !

i had thought the 1871 census may have been my ishmael (he was born in Bolton Greater Manchester, but i would imagine the family is welsh in origin,  my nain margaret, used to tell me they were from the tudors/Hughes of Mon;  but that could be a little OTT and wishful thinking  !!! and its the memory of mine as a youngster her telling me).

by 1907 they had moved from ellerslea to 4 mostyn crescent  and it was called quorn house. 1911 census show margaret there, with the housemaid,   and her mother emma was actually visiting her parents in shropshire at the date of the census.  and in 1926  Emmas last will and testament,  said she was living at quorn Villa, Trinity street.  (the solicitors address was tringity street /sq  so i am not sure if she moved houses  and used the name quorn again and   or if its still mostyn crescent.

i have just recently attended my father funeral and managed to get some oldish photos of Emma, and possibly ishmaels parents taken in Llandudno at a place called Baron Hill Llandudno is written on the back of it.  of a mr and mrs robert hughes,  and the info i was given was that somehow,  he (the father of ishmael) was involved in its building.  so looking into that is how i found myself on this forum!!!

so i think i shall post this,  my computer is going to run out of battery, and re read the infos you sent me,  and see what else i can share.   
so  hughes family living in Llandudno  hunting the census recs  for a robert hughes,  without much else knowledge i gave up because that is guesswork at this moment.  but i do see there was a baron hill  in Llandudno.

be back soon;
thanks Karen


Offline norman08

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Re: Margaret Anne Pearl Hughes
« Reply #6 on: March 19, 2014, 08:38:29 pm »
are we related do you reckon  hugo

Offline karenjadejoy

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Re: Margaret Anne Pearl Hughes
« Reply #7 on: March 19, 2014, 09:19:57 pm »
are we related do you reckon  hugo
to me you mean?? hello norman

Offline norman08

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Re: Margaret Anne Pearl Hughes
« Reply #8 on: March 19, 2014, 10:18:51 pm »
hi karen ,hugo and i are related  ,we are hughes also so we will see lol.

Offline Hugo

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Re: Margaret Anne Pearl Hughes
« Reply #9 on: March 19, 2014, 10:22:03 pm »
are we related do you reckon  hugo

Karen,  Norman and I are first cousins and our surname is Hughes but I don't think we are related to you.   I don't know if you know this Norman but Taid Samuel's  father Hugh and his father Evan were from Llanengan on the Llyn Peninsula and they were in the 1861 Census living in Queen Street Llandudno ( now part of Cwlach Street)

Offline karenjadejoy

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Re: Margaret Anne Pearl Hughes
« Reply #10 on: March 19, 2014, 10:25:40 pm »
also margaret was married from quorn villa trinity st. 2/21926

cert entry no. 75    at new english presbyterian church llandudno conway county of caernarfon. wales
marg 26yrs of quorn villa, trinity st.  llandudno.(her father ishmael,  deceased in colorado usa)
harry 30yrs of 8 mallow rd west derby liverpool musician cellist       source: marriage cert:

Offline karenjadejoy

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Re: Margaret Anne Pearl Hughes
« Reply #11 on: March 19, 2014, 10:29:19 pm »
hi karen ,hugo and i are related  ,we are hughes also so we will see lol.

lots of Hughes in Wales  !!!  and out of it lol

Offline Hugo

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Re: Margaret Anne Pearl Hughes
« Reply #12 on: March 19, 2014, 10:48:26 pm »
The Conwy Archives in Llandudno has a lot of local info in it and it is a good source if you are looking for something or someone in the area.
I was looking at the original Llandudno Advertiser papers for 1945 but was going to look for info on your Nain's wedding in 1926 but that is on microfilm and unfortunately I was pressed for time and couldn't do it.

Offline karenjadejoy

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Re: Margaret Anne Pearl Hughes
« Reply #13 on: March 19, 2014, 11:41:39 pm »
i just been reading through the info shared so far that you found Hugo,
and you have a detail re Ishmael that he is welsh speaking,   i guess he could have picked it up on the farm as a youngster,  but i would more likely think he learned it as a child,  thus speculating that his parents were welsh speaking.   and although born in Bolton.  how did he choose to end up on a farm in Llandudno, may have come from that area originally.

  one would again speculate that perhaps his parents robert and mrs Hughes, just remembered her name. anne/annie owens b c1845 unknown anything else about her at this time. (Ishmaels birth certificate). may have been from N wales are or settled there later on after manchester.   and on Ishmaels last will and testament he has a witness or executor called John owen of avallon abbey road Llandudno,  could perhaps be linked to the same owen family as his mother.

comments  anyone?

and i also have a photo called the three neins,  in which one is anne owen, i am told . taken at pyllai/pyllau farm its hand written on back  "one of the lasies is margarets great grandmother and presumably her two grandmothers meaning the three neins of margaret pearl,  they are pretty old fashioned looking!!!  but are their any records of owens at Pyllau farm? or Hughes for that matter. does anyone know. they could also just have been on a day out and taken a photo there with their 1800 style digital camera  :laugh:

again thanks im finding these things exciting,

edit:  the photo says margarets great grandmother MRS Owens  so its possible its anne ownes her mother !!and grandma walton (yes my dads name is john Walton southworth) good night grandma ........

Offline Hugo

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Re: Margaret Anne Pearl Hughes
« Reply #14 on: March 20, 2014, 10:22:10 am »
i just been reading through the info shared so far that you found Hugo,
and you have a detail re Ishmael that he is welsh speaking,   i guess he could have picked it up on the farm as a youngster,  but i would more likely think he learned it as a child,  thus speculating that his parents were welsh speaking.   and although born in Bolton.  how did he choose to end up on a farm in Llandudno, may have come from that area originally.

  one would again speculate that perhaps his parents robert and mrs Hughes, just remembered her name. anne/annie owens b c1845 unknown anything else about her at this time. (Ishmaels birth certificate). may have been from N wales are or settled there later on after manchester.   and on Ishmaels last will and testament he has a witness or executor called John owen of avallon abbey road Llandudno,  could perhaps be linked to the same owen family as his mother.

comments  anyone?

and i also have a photo called the three neins,  in which one is anne owen, i am told . taken at pyllai/pyllau farm its hand written on back  "one of the lasies is margarets great grandmother and presumably her two grandmothers meaning the three neins of margaret pearl,  they are pretty old fashioned looking!!!  but are their any records of owens at Pyllau farm? or Hughes for that matter. does anyone know. they could also just have been on a day out and taken a photo there with their 1800 style digital camera  :laugh:
...

Karen,   now that you have mentioned the Christian names of your GG Grandparents it will be easier to trace on the Census forms and I'll have another look asap.   I suspect that Ishmael does have a connection to Llandudno and hopefully we can find out what that is.
Now another coincidence perhaps but we have another forum member called Jom who has been asking about his ancestors, one of whom was called John Owen.   It would be worth looking through those postings to see if there is any link for you to follow, alternatively you could use the search engine on the forum to find out about Pyllau Farm and the Owen link.