Poll

What do you think should be the way forward for the Pier Pavilion site?

Modern design, as put forward by Mr Waldron, featuring restaurants, apartments etc
4 (6.1%)
Recreation of original Pier Pavilion design, but with leisure and entertainment facilities inside
50 (75.8%)
Larger version of original design, with leisure, entertainment and apartments included
8 (12.1%)
Leave site empty for another 20 years
4 (6.1%)

Total Members Voted: 66

Author Topic: Re: Llandudno's Pier Pavilion redevelopment site  (Read 379860 times)

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Offline Hugo

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Re: Llandudno's Pier Pavilion redevelopment site
« Reply #1005 on: May 21, 2018, 12:41:28 pm »
That's a good point Steve and I would also be interested to know what was more important than a planning application that would have a permanent affect on Llandudno

Offline CMG

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Re: Llandudno's Pier Pavilion redevelopment site
« Reply #1006 on: May 21, 2018, 12:51:27 pm »
Concerns now...well where to start!  I have written to the Highways department as I would like to know how the build is to be managed...they have not replied yet (3 weeks ago). 
My concerns are that given that Mr Waldron has nowhere on the actual land he owns to house his portacabins (5 were on the Lifeboat Station build and 4 behind St Tudno Hotel), his plant and heavy machinery, his tons and tons of building supplies and has nowhere to park dozens of contractor vehicles where are these going to be situated.  I can only assume on the road next to the site?  This will most likely entail having to close off half the road to accommodate this site annexe.  So at the Church Walks roundabout and by the Grand Hotel there will need to be traffic lights to control the flow of traffic.  This will mean no parking anywhere along that stretch of North Parade.  How will us hoteliers get our weekly deliveries as vehicles will not be allowed to stop in the middle of a traffic light area?  How will our refuse be collected...again the lorries cant stop and hold up traffic?  Where will the dozens of contractor vehicles park?  How will deliveries be controlled?  How will the traffic jams this will create at busy times be mitigated?

On a different tack I also asked the Highways department to explain how resurfacing Maelgwyn car park will mitigate for a shortfall of 195 spaces needed for the commercial element of the building?  Where will the 12-15 spaces lost on North Parade outside the building be relocated.  The Highways department have already stated (in a written briefing to councillors on the planning committee last December) that these spaces will be relocated elsewhere on North Parade...there is NO WHERE else on North Parade for any extra spaces. 
Dave Watson in the planning department told me, in writing, some time ago that conditions would be put on the planning permission, one being that no building work can start until the issue of access to the pier is sorted out.  I assume that will be a legal battle between Waldron and Adam Williams.  I hope that condition IS applied to the permission and not conveniently ignored!
I am in contact with my two local councillors about these issues.


Offline Bri Roberts

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Re: Llandudno's Pier Pavilion redevelopment site
« Reply #1007 on: May 21, 2018, 06:02:38 pm »
We had a wander last week and noticed there are signs along the grass verge border between the pier gates and the Grand Hotel stating that land belongs to the pier.

All the kiosks on the pier bordering the development site are occupied for the season and the second entrance by the angling shop has restricted pedestrian access because of ongoing pier repairs.


Offline Blongb

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Re: Llandudno's Pier Pavilion redevelopment site
« Reply #1008 on: May 21, 2018, 08:43:35 pm »
We had a wander last week and noticed there are signs along the grass verge border between the pier gates and the Grand Hotel stating that land belongs to the pier.

The Pier's boundary is defined by the Blue Victorian Railings Bri, up to the gate that gives access into the Pier Pavilion Site. The Grass strip and Pavement is owned by Mostyn Estates but leased to CCBC as part of the Promenade and there should be absolutely no Parking there as it's now covered by new By-Laws which should be policed by the Beach Wardens but they have been given no authority to issue tickets by the Conwy Harbour Master, who is in overall control.  :-\
Quot homines tot sententiae: suus cuique mos.
(There are as many opinions as there are people: each has his own view.)

Offline philfishlaw

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Re: Llandudno's Pier Pavilion redevelopment site
« Reply #1009 on: May 21, 2018, 10:07:07 pm »
Hi All, Thanks for the welcome, I am sure it will be " interesting " at times but you know what they say about interesting times. Steveh, Hugo and TELL asked what the other meeting was. In my case I was at the Snowdonia nation park planing meeting (I was appointed to represent CCBC)   which over ran and then trafic issues returning from Tan y bwlch. It was my intention to try to attend both meetings but circumstanc interviend

Offline Hugo

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Re: Llandudno's Pier Pavilion redevelopment site
« Reply #1010 on: May 22, 2018, 01:04:58 pm »
Thanks philfishlaw for explaining the situation for us.  I've looked at the minutes of the meetings for the Snowdonia National Park Planning committee and can see that three people have been elected to represent the Conwy County Borough Council and note from those minutes that Chris Hughes was not present at the meeting on the 7th March 2018 and he sent his apologies.

In his absence CCBC was represented by two people namely yourself and Ifor Glyn Lloyd so if it could be done then, couldn't it be done for an extremely important local issue like the Pier Pavilion and apologies could then be made to the Snowdonia National Park on your behalf because although the Snowdonia meeting started at 10.00 am they are notorious for going over time and there is also the distance involved between Maentwrog and Bodlondeb

Offline philfishlaw

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Re: Llandudno's Pier Pavilion redevelopment site
« Reply #1011 on: May 22, 2018, 09:49:11 pm »
Hi Hugo,
Yes I could have offered my apologies for Snowdonia national park but I expected to get back for the  conwy meeting, More fool me! Also to be quite honest I did not expect the vote to be that close. We all learn from experience for which I can only apologise. This is one of the reasons that I have joined this site, to get the views of other people.

Offline Hugo

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Re: Llandudno's Pier Pavilion redevelopment site
« Reply #1012 on: May 22, 2018, 10:39:52 pm »
Thanks  very much philfishlaw for your honest reply which is very much appreciated.   I had spoken to an experienced planning officer prior to the meeting and he did voice that some members were not happy with the proposed building but their hands may be tied by the planning regulations but I was still surprised to see that he had voted in favour of the proposed application

Offline TELL

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Re: Llandudno's Pier Pavilion redevelopment site
« Reply #1013 on: May 23, 2018, 09:49:18 am »
Good Morning Phil, which way would you have voted on the Pier Pavilion Apllication if you had been able to get to the meeting in time?

Offline CMG

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Re: Llandudno's Pier Pavilion redevelopment site
« Reply #1014 on: May 24, 2018, 01:21:29 pm »
I ran into Tom (used to own The Elm Tree Hotel) last night.  He know Waldron (slightly) bumps into him sometimes drinking in Snooze.  He said he had seen him recently and asked when building work would start.  Waldron replied that he did not know as he would be selling it on to a builder!!!

Offline Bri Roberts

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Re: Llandudno's Pier Pavilion redevelopment site
« Reply #1015 on: May 24, 2018, 03:37:42 pm »
The Pier's boundary is defined by the Blue Victorian Railings Bri, up to the gate that gives access into the Pier Pavilion Site. The Grass strip and Pavement is owned by Mostyn Estates.

Thank you, Blongb, for the clarification.

Reading those signs again today, it is rather confusing.


Offline norman08

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Re: Llandudno's Pier Pavilion redevelopment site.
« Reply #1016 on: May 24, 2018, 10:43:04 pm »
When the pier company sold the pavilion in 1983 was it the pavilion alone or the land it stood on aswell 🤔

Offline Merddin Emrys

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Re: Llandudno's Pier Pavilion redevelopment site
« Reply #1017 on: May 25, 2018, 07:09:26 am »
That sign says a fine of £100, I thought that only the government or councils could issue fines?
A pigeon is for life not just Christmas

Offline OrmeMac

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Re: Llandudno's Pier Pavilion redevelopment site
« Reply #1018 on: May 25, 2018, 10:54:43 am »
That sign says a fine of £100, I thought that only the government or councils could issue fines?

Not if it is private land surely?

Offline Meleri

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Re: Llandudno's Pier Pavilion redevelopment site
« Reply #1019 on: May 25, 2018, 02:40:43 pm »
Councillor Phil, I'm pleased to see that as a member of CCBC and The Planning Committee you are seeking views from Members of The Three Towns Forum on our opinions regarding Llandudno's Pier Pavilion Site application.
Reading though the thoughts of other members I came across Hugo's comment on the Snowdonia National Park's meeting you attended on 7th March 2018 and your comment on how you regretfully couldn't make the Planning Committee meeting that day as the SNP meeting ran over time.
The fact is I attended the Planning Committee Meeting where the Pier Pavilion application was heard and I can remember Councillor Ivor Lloyd (who also represents CCBC on the SNP Planning & Access Committee) being present and voting on it, but the date of the Planning Committee Meeting was 14th March.
During this meeting as it ran late and ended 5.30pm, three Councillors :-Trevor Stott, Austin Roberts & Chris Cater left before the end and the Chairperson had to ask the remaining Councillors not to leave until the end of the meeting as there wouldn't legally be enough Councillors to vote. Which brings me to my point, the Planning Committee Members are only expected to attend 12 meeting a year, sometimes barely lasting an hour or two occasionally longer, as it did in March, surely the least they can do is stay until the end. The more members the livelier the debate and every application stands on it's own merit and is important to not only the applicant but the people whose lives can change drastically by some of these applications. You as Councillors have the voice to represent both sides and should think seriously if you have the time to honestly give to these meetings, if not then step down. One young Councillor at the CCBC AGM stated that he would love the challenge of a position, so please could you convey this to other members and share out the work load so these young people can gain experience. Thank you for this opportunity to give you my opinion.